Topics

Refrigerator cars


genegreen1942@...
 

A film on YouTube showed about a half dozen refrigerator cars at the head of a string of cars being pulled from an LCL facility.  Would those cars have likely been loaded as refrigerator cars or as ersatz box cars?


Would long strings of PFE refrigerator cars or even whole trains of PFE reefers have continued off the UP at Omaha and onto the C&NW to Chicago?


Gene Green


Rob & Bev Manley
 

Gene,

I remember about the time the Tichy PFE reefer came out Bob Hundaman said that he remembered long strings of them being pulled into Blue Island, Ilinois behind Rock Island R-67s.

 

Rob Manley

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2014 11:03 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Refrigerator cars

 

 

A film on YouTube showed about a half dozen refrigerator cars at the head of a string of cars being pulled from an LCL facility.  Would those cars have likely been loaded as refrigerator cars or as ersatz box cars?

 

Would long strings of PFE refrigerator cars or even whole trains of PFE reefers have continued off the UP at Omaha and onto the C&NW to Chicago?

 

Gene Green


thecitrusbelt@...
 

Gene -


 Do you recall the name of the film or do you have the YouTube link?


Thanks.


Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


genegreen1942@...
 

Bob,
See Rolling the Freight on the Chicago & North Western System - American Railroad in 1947 - WDTVLIVE42

 

 


John Barry
 

Santa Fe instructions for LCL called for use of MTY reefers on many routes.  They are available at http://www.atsfrr.org/resources/KJordan/LCL1946.pdf  This allowed backhauls with loads of otherwise empty reefers and lowered the need for box cars.
 
John Barry


ATSF North Bay Lines
Golden Gates & Fast Freights


707-490-9696


3450 Palmer Drive, Suite 4224
Cameron Park, CA 95682


From: "genegreen1942@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2014 9:02 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Refrigerator cars

 
A film on YouTube showed about a half dozen refrigerator cars at the head of a string of cars being pulled from an LCL facility.  Would those cars have likely been loaded as refrigerator cars or as ersatz box cars?

Would long strings of PFE refrigerator cars or even whole trains of PFE reefers have continued off the UP at Omaha and onto the C&NW to Chicago?

Gene Green



Tony Thompson
 

John Barry wrote:

Santa Fe instructions for LCL called for use of MTY reefers on many routes.  They are available at http://www.atsfrr.org/resources/KJordan/LCL1946.pdf  This allowed backhauls with loads of otherwise empty reefers and lowered the need for box cars.

    interesting, but remember that ALL reefer owners were obliged to let reefers run freely instead of being returned to owners, and that reefers could be substituted anywhere for box cars (at a ratio of 3 to 2, IIRC), due to wartime needs, until 1948. So this was not a Santa Fe decision alone. I am not sure when this rule was instituted, for those early-war-period modelers.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Tony Thompson
 

Gene Green wrote:

Would long strings of PFE refrigerator cars or even whole trains of PFE reefers have continued off the UP at Omaha and onto the C&NW to Chicago?

   Yes, certainly in harvest season.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Schuyler Larrabee
 

And, Gene, they frequently were forwarded to the ERIE for points east, particularly NYC.  For years, the ERIE carried more fruit and produce to NYC than the other obvious choices.  Faster service, fewer locations where things were  switched.

 

Schuyler

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Sunday, June 29, 2014 6:41 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Refrigerator cars

 

 

Gene Green wrote:

 

Would long strings of PFE refrigerator cars or even whole trains of PFE reefers have continued off the UP at Omaha and onto the C&NW to Chicago?

 

   Yes, certainly in harvest season.

 

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA

2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com

(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...

Publishers of books on railroad history

 

 

 


Guy Wilber
 

Tony Thompson wrote:
 
"interesting, but remember that ALL reefer owners were obliged to let reefers run freely instead of being returned to owners, and that reefers could be substituted anywhere for box cars (at a ratio of 3 to 2, IIRC), due to wartime ne eds, until 1948. So this was not a Santa Fe decision alone. I am not sure when this rule was instituted, for those early-war-period modelers."
 
 
ICC Service Order 104, first issued on January 19, 1943, though there were subsequent amendments as well as complete new orders covering the use of refrigerator cars:   "Railroads transporting west-bound transcontinental shipments, in carloads, destined to points in the States of California, Idaho, Arizona, Nevada and Utah may, at their option, furnish and transport not more than three refrigerator cars of Pacific Fruit Express or Santa Fe Refrigerator Dispatch ownership in lieu of each boxcar ordered subject to the carload minimum weight which would have applied if the shipment had been loaded in a boxcar." 
 
 
Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada


lstt100
 

I'll add to Guy's reply.

Prior to ICC Service Order 104, the ICC issued Service Order 95 on Nov 9, 1942 appointing an agent of the ICC to control movement of refrigerator cars and created an advisory committee.  It authorized the agent of the ICC, when necessary, to direct the distribution of all refrigerator cars without regard to ownership or assignment.

ICC Service Order 104 also made the order "permissive as applying to "carriers" and mandatory as applying to "shippers".  ICC Service Order 104 became mandatory on Sept 1, 1943.  It was further modified on Aug 4, 1945, if available, it required use of any ownership reefers for westbound loading to all points west of eastern boundaries of New Mexico, Colorado, Wyoming, and Montana and also allowed loading from Utah to California or Nevada and from Washington to California.

ICC Service Order 104 expired on June 30, 1949 and was covered by specific tariffs after this date.

Dan Holbrook


np328
 

I have uploaded some documents found at the Minnesota Historical Society in the Northern Pacific Co files.

 

These are AAR documents and the desk staff on site OK'd these of any copyright restrictions on the MHS's part as he felt these were originally for open distribution from the AAR and so they are posted here.

 

The orders covering the substitution of refrigerator cars for box cars are listed from inception to about 1956. No info past that date was present.

 

These 10 pages in the folder list the history of substitution arrangement - Refrigerator Cars for Box Cars on Westbound Continental Traffic, and are found in the file: Refrigerator Cars for Box Cars Refrigerator Cars for Box Cars

 

James Dick - Roseville, MN


Ken Roth
 

I'm a little late on the discussion, but the best "non-food" load I ever saw was a picture in a little book on the history of Grants Pass, Oregon.  In it was a picture of a PFE 40-10 reefer being unloaded in Grants Pass, and ... the cargo?  Refrigerators !!

    Ken Roth


Allan Smith
 

Reefers for Boxcars


I have conductors lists from the Sierra RR in 1952, they show three reefers used as boxcars. The load cartons. AMRX 50000, PFE 96144 and MDT 5475


Al Smith