Flatcar deck color
All - I purchased a Bachman 52' N&W flatcar for use at the interchange on my B&O Shenandoah SD layout. The simulated wood deck is painted flat black like the rest of the car. Given the built date on the car is 5-56 and the setting for my layout is fall 1956, what would be the actual color of the deck? It just does not look right as it is now. Thanks.
Fran Giacoma
"I purchased a Bachman[n] 52' N&W flatcar for use at the interchange on my B&O Shenandoah SD layout. The simulated wood deck is painted flat black like the rest of the car. Given the built date on the car is 5-56 and the setting for my layout is fall 1956, what would be the actual color of the deck? It just does not look right as it is now."
Builders photos of N&W Class F-3 (built June 1953) from the Virginia Tech Norfolk Southern collection:
http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns2473.jpeg
http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns2549.jpeg
Unfortunately, they're in black and white and don't give you a conclusive answer, but the decks are definitely not a light "fresh" lumber color.
Ben Hom
If the cars aren't new &/or fresh out of the paint shop, the decks show whatever USE & ABUSE from the loads being carried. After any use at all, the decks were littered w/ trash, stains, etc, etc, etc. .And no great care was given during loading/unloading either. In the real world no one ever worried about what flat car decks looked like after use, so modelers shouldn't worry about it either.
1) Natural wood, typically Oak, Douglas Fir, or Southern Yellow pine. The first two are considerably darker than our model stripwood, with a pinkish or redish cast. Yellow pine is, well, yellow. All of these weathered to a silver gray in just a year or so.
2) Treated wood, which in the steam era meant creosote. Initially dark brown or oily black when new, these eventually weathered to a lighter gray, but always darker than natural wood.
3) Paint.
Since in the B&W builders photo Ben cited there is absolutely no tonal difference between the upward facing surfaces of the wood, the cast steel bolster and draft sill, and the bolt heads pulled into the wood, I surmise that this deck is painted.Since we know the car is black, the deck must also be black. Yes, it will eventually lose its paint, but not likely in the first year. Scrapes and gouges are a different story.
Dennis (who spent way too much time laying those black boards) Storzek
Regards
Bruce
Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
https://www5.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/
Three possibilities for flatcar decks:
1) Natural wood, typically Oak, Douglas Fir, or Southern Yellow pine. The first two are considerably darker than our model stripwood, with a pinkish or redish cast. Yellow pine is, well, yellow. All of these weathered to a silver gray in just a year or so.
2) Treated wood, which in the steam era meant creosote. Initially dark brown or oily black when new, these eventually weathered to a lighter gray, but always darker than natural wood.
3) Paint.
Since in the B&W builders photo Ben cited there is absolutely no tonal difference between the upward facing surfaces of the wood, the cast steel bolster and draft sill, and the bolt heads pulled into the wood, I surmise that this deck is painted.Since we know the car is black, the deck must also be black. Yes, it will eventually lose its paint, but not likely in the first year. Scrapes and gouges are a different story.
Dennis (who spent way too much time l! aying those black boards) Storzek
"In the real world no one ever worried about what flat car decks looked like after use, so modelers shouldn't worry about it either."
That's like saying "in the real world no one ever worried about cars getting dirty so modelers shouldn't worry about weathering either."
Ben Hom
were treated with creosote -- and why waste paint on them? The steel was
most likely painted top and bottom before the deck was applied, just as
box car underframes were painted before the unpainted and untreated floors
were installed. Creosote decks weathered differently than untreated decks
and as Bruce points out, probably different woods (softwood/hardwood) also
weathered differently.
A good way to represent the N&W model as new might be to add satin/gloss
to the steel and use a flat coat on the wood -- since the creosoted wood is
less shiny than steel.
It's distressing how hard it is to find good flat car deck pictures, especially
new cars. I have hundreds of images of box car roofs, but very few flat cars.
It's like photographers saw a flat car, and turned away.
Tim O'Connor
My intent was to say a modeler can do nothing wrong w/ weathering. There's a very good probability it has happened in the real world. That was my experience in my conductor days..
__________________________________________________
J. Stephen Sandifer
Minister Emeritus, Southwest Central Church of Christ
Webmaster, Santa Fe Railway Historical and Modeling Society
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 10:04 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Flatcar deck color
."And no great care was given during loading/unloading either. In the real world no one ever worried about what flat car decks looked like after use, so modelers shouldn't worry about it either."
My intent was to say a modeler can do nothing wrong w/ weathering. There's a very good probability it has happened in the real world. That was my experience in my conductor days..
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Is the tractor like vehicle at the top of the second image a form of track mobile / car mover?
The wheel configuration looks like it would allow two wheels inside the gage and two outside.
Thanks
Matt Goodman
Columbus, Ohio
Sent from my mobile
Fran Giacoma asked:
"I purchased a Bachman[n] 52' N&W flatcar for use at the interchange on my B&O Shenandoah SD layout. The simulated wood deck is painted flat black like the rest of the car. Given the built date on the car is 5-56 and the setting for my layout is fall 1956, what would be the actual color of the deck? It just does not look right as it is now."
Builders photos of N&W Class F-3 (built June 1953) from the Virginia Tech Norfolk Southern collection:
http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns2473.jpeg
http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns2549.jpeg
Unfortunately, they're in black and white and don't give you a conclusive answer, but the decks are definitely not a light "fresh" lumber color.
Ben Hom
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Posted by: Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
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Yahoo Groups Links
Tangent alert...
Is the tractor like vehicle at the top of the second image a form of track mobile / car mover?
The wheel configuration looks like it would allow two wheels inside the gage and two outside.
Thanks
Matt Goodman
Columbus, Ohio
Sent from my mobile
On Sep 15, 2014, at 7:57 PM, "Benjamin Hom b.hom@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:
Fran Giacoma asked:
"I purchased a Bachman[n] 52' N&W flatcar for use at the interchange on my B&O Shenandoah SD layout. The simulated wood deck is painted flat black like the rest of the car. Given the built date on the car is 5-56 and the setting for my layout is fall 1956, what would be the actual color of the deck? It just does not look right as it is now."
Builders photos of N&W Class F-3 (built June 1953) from the Virginia Tech Norfolk Southern collection:
http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns2473.jpeg
http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns2549.jpeg
Unfortunately, they're in black and white and don't give you a conclusive answer, but the decks are definitely not a light "fresh" lumber color.
Ben Hom
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Posted by: Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
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------------------------------------
Yahoo Groups Links
-------- Original message --------
From: "Matt Goodman goodman312@... [STMFC]"
Date:09/19/2014 7:32 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Flatcar deck color
Tangent alert...
Is the tractor like vehicle at the top of the second image a form of track mobile / car mover?
The wheel configuration looks like it would allow two wheels inside the gage and two outside.
Thanks
Matt Goodman
Columbus, Ohio
Sent from my mobile
On Sep 15, 2014, at 7:57 PM, "Benjamin Hom b.hom@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:
Fran Giacoma asked:
"I purchased a Bachman[n] 52' N&W flatcar for use at the interchange on my B&O Shenandoah SD layout. The simulated wood deck is painted flat black like the rest of the car. Given the built date on the car is 5-56 and the setting for my layout is fall 1956, what would be the actual color of the deck? It just does not look right as it is now."
Builders photos of N&W Class F-3 (built June 1953) from the Virginia Tech Norfolk Southern collection:
http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns2473.jpeg
http://spec.lib.vt.edu/imagebase/norfolksouthern/full/ns2549.jpeg
Unfortunately, they're in black and white and don't give you a conclusive answer, but the decks are definitely not a light "fresh" lumber color.
Ben Hom
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Posted by: Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
------------------------------------
------------------------------------
Yahoo Groups Links
Norman Maclean
Tangent alert...
Is the tractor like vehicle at the top of the second image a form of track mobile / car mover?
The wheel configuration looks like it would allow two wheels inside the gage and two outside.
Thanks
Matt Goodman
Columbus, Ohio