Even Colored Car Roofs


Rod Miller
 

Clear color photo:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=504225&nseq=165

Nary a blotched roof in sight.
--
Rod Miller
Handcraftsman
===
Custom 2-rail O Scale Models: Drives, | O Scale West / S West
Repairs, Steam Loco Building, More | 2015 Meet is Feb 5 - 7
http://www.rodmiller.com | http://www.oscalewest.com


Nelson Moyer <ku0a@...>
 

The most surprising thing about this picture to me is the black stock car
roof. The information I have is that board roofs and underbodies were
painted mineral red like the sides and ends. Apparently that wasn't
universal.



Unfortunately, not enough of the car shows for me to identify the class. Can
anybody out figure out if this is an SM16/18 or SM19 stock car?



Nelson Moyer



From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 2:27 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Even Colored Car Roofs





Clear color photo:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=504225&nseq=165

Nary a blotched roof in sight.
--
Rod Miller
Handcraftsman
===
Custom 2-rail O Scale Models: Drives, | O Scale West / S West
Repairs, Steam Loco Building, More | 2015 Meet is Feb 5 - 7
http://www.rodmiller.com | http://www.oscalewest.com


arved_grass
 

I'll ask Jeff Swanson's question here, as it struck me, as well:

"Why does the Fruit Growers Express reefer have 'F.H.I.X.' reporting marks? (I understand the 'X')"

Thanks. That changes my mind a lot about modeling cars with paint failures on the roof. Should be a relatively rare exception given the sample in this photo.

Arved Grass
Arved_Grass@yahoo.com or Arved@I-Do-Photography.com
Fleming Island, Florida

--------------------------------------------

On Fri, 11/14/14, Rod Miller rod@rodmiller.com [STMFC] <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: [STMFC] Even Colored Car Roofs
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, November 14, 2014, 3:27 PM
















 









Clear color photo:



http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=504225&nseq=165



Nary a blotched roof in sight.

--

Rod Miller

Handcraftsman

===

Custom 2-rail O Scale Models: Drives, | O Scale West / S
West

Repairs, Steam Loco Building, More | 2015 Meet is Feb
5 - 7

http://www.rodmiller.com |
http://www.oscalewest.com


Chuck Higdon
 

Hello Nelson,



Are you sure that is a black roof? The walkway supports look like they were
red at some point and I think I see some red "under the black dirt".



Take care,

Chuck Higdon





From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 3:51 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Even Colored Car Roofs





The most surprising thing about this picture to me is the black stock car
roof. The information I have is that board roofs and underbodies were
painted mineral red like the sides and ends. Apparently that wasn't
universal.

Unfortunately, not enough of the car shows for me to identify the class. Can
anybody out figure out if this is an SM16/18 or SM19 stock car?

Nelson Moyer

From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 2:27 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Even Colored Car Roofs

Clear color photo:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=504225&nseq=165

Nary a blotched roof in sight.
--
Rod Miller
Handcraftsman
===
Custom 2-rail O Scale Models: Drives, | O Scale West / S West
Repairs, Steam Loco Building, More | 2015 Meet is Feb 5 - 7
http://www.rodmiller.com | http://www.oscalewest.com


Tony Thompson
 

Rod Miller  wrote:

 

Clear color photo:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=504225&nseq=165

Nary a blotched roof in sight.


      Good photo to make the point, Rod. Richard Hendrickson and I agreed, and both of us said publicly, that many transition-era modelers exaggerate paint failure on roofs. Sure, it existed, but it was neither very common nor, in most cases, very severe. Today's freight cars, with different paint and different maintenance attitudes, are a different matter. As always, following a photo is a good procedure.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





gary laakso
 

As I noted before, this picture can be found as a full 2 page spread in the Summer 2014 Classic Trains at pages 14 and 15.  There are even colored roofs but not from paint specs for the 4 CB&Q cars nor the Milwaukee ribbed boxcar nor the NYC boxcar.  Was the CNW boxcar roof painted black?
 
gary laakso
south of Mike Brock  
 

Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 4:34 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Even Colored Car Roofs
 
 

Rod Miller  wrote:

 

Clear color photo:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=504225&nseq=165

Nary a blotched roof in sight.

 
      Good photo to make the point, Rod. Richard Hendrickson and I agreed, and both of us said publicly, that many transition-era modelers exaggerate paint failure on roofs. Sure, it existed, but it was neither very common nor, in most cases, very severe. Today's freight cars, with different paint and different maintenance attitudes, are a different matter. As always, following a photo is a good procedure.
 
Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history
 




Tim O'Connor
 

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=504225&nseq=165

"Why does the Fruit Growers Express reefer have 'F.H.I.X.' reporting marks?"

Thanks. That changes my mind a lot about modeling cars with paint failures on the roof.
Should be a relatively rare exception given the sample in this photo.
Arved Grass


Arved, really? From a sample size of about 10 cars including one
nearly new reefer and 4 box cars that had unpainted galvanized roofs,
you would infer that roof paint failure was rare? The only one I'm
not sure about is that NYC box -- can't tell if the roof is original
or a replacement but the car has post-1955 paint.

The SP box car in the background originally had a painted roof -- but
it's all worn off except for the seam caps.

1958 is the start of "my era" of modeling -- Lots of shiny new cars
and plenty of older cars too. Great assortment in this photo!

The "FHIX" stood for Fruit Growers Express, High Insulation" -- there
were also WHIX cars for Western Fruit Express. These cars had 33% more
cubic capacity than conventional 40 foot ice reefers.

Tim

P.S. If you need some photos of roof paint failure I can send you some. :-)


Tony Thompson
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:

 

Thanks. That changes my mind a lot about modeling cars with paint failures on the roof.
Should be a relatively rare exception given the sample in this photo.
Arved Grass

Arved, really? From a sample size of about 10 cars including one
nearly new reefer and 4 box cars that had unpainted galvanized roofs,
you would infer that roof paint failure was rare? 


     As I said, Tim, Richard and I, on the basis of LOTS of photos, concluded what Arved concluded. Richard was, as you know, a most meticulous follower of prototype photos (the main reason he collected so many, more than 30,000). When attaching route cards on some of his models, he bent them slightly so that they do not lay flat on the route card board -- something you see in some photos. But he only represented roof paint failure, and that lightly, on a FEW of his more than 200 completed freight cars.
      You are right, 10 cars is too small a sample to mean much. But I believe your implication, that this sample tells the wrong story, is simply incorrect.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Tim O'Connor
 

Tony

I agree and disagree :-) Modelers often exaggerate it, but it was very common.
In the industrial northeast before the EPA, the acid in the air was so severe
that automobile roofs and lids would peel! I grew up in New Jersey in a soup of
polluted air, and saw this frequently. Earl Scheib had plenty of customers in
NJ/PA in those days.

Tim O'Connor


Clear color photo:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=504225&nseq=165

Nary a blotched roof in sight.

      Good photo to make the point, Rod. Richard Hendrickson and I agreed, and both of us said publicly, that many transition-era modelers exaggerate paint failure on roofs. Sure, it existed, but it was neither very common nor, in most cases, very severe. Today's freight cars, with different paint and different maintenance attitudes, are a different matter. As always, following a photo is a good procedure.

Tony Thompson 


Tim O'Connor
 

Yes the CNW box car roof was (and is) black, albeit faded and worn. The
Rock Island box car next to it shows peeling on the roof.

Tim O'Connor

As I noted before, this picture can be found as a full 2 page spread in the Summer 2014 Classic Trains at pages 14 and 15. There are even colored roofs but not from paint specs for the 4 CB&Q cars nor the Milwaukee ribbed boxcar nor the NYC boxcar. Was the CNW boxcar roof painted black?

gary laakso


Tim O'Connor
 


Richard modeled 1947. I model 11-20 years after that time period. A lot
of stuff changed. But as I said, modelers often exaggerate the effect. You
should see the damage that "modern" modelers do to their equipment -- I've
seen models of 5 year old cars that look like they spent 40 years alternating
between rain forest and desert, attacked by legions of graffiti artists. :-)

But a sample size of 10 tells no story at all, if you're looking to extrapolate.

Tim O'Connor

     As I said, Tim, Richard and I, on the basis of LOTS of photos, concluded what Arved concluded. Richard was, as you know, a most meticulous follower of prototype photos (the main reason he collected so many, more than 30,000). When attaching route cards on some of his models, he bent them slightly so that they do not lay flat on the route card board -- something you see in some photos. But he only represented roof paint failure, and that lightly, on a FEW of his more than 200 completed freight cars.
      You are right, 10 cars is too small a sample to mean much. But I believe your implication, that this sample tells the wrong story, is simply incorrect.

Tony Thompson 


caboose9792@...
 

Also note the graffiti on the CB&Q boxcar a behind the tender. I suspect that is old school involving a brush and a can of paint.  
Mark Rickert
 

In a message dated 11/14/2014 5:07:13 P.M. Central Standard Time, STMFC@... writes:
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=504225&nseq=165

"Why does the Fruit Growers Express reefer have 'F.H.I.X.' reporting marks?"

Thanks. That changes my mind a lot about modeling cars with paint failures on the roof.
Should be a relatively rare exception given the sample in this photo.
Arved Grass

Arved, really? From a sample size of about 10 cars including one
nearly new reefer and 4 box cars that had unpainted galvanized roofs,
you would infer that roof paint failure was rare? The only one I'm
not sure about is that NYC box -- can't tell if the roof is original
or a replacement but the car has post-1955 paint.

The SP box car in the background originally had a painted roof -- but
it's all worn off except for the seam caps.

1958 is the start of "my era" of modeling -- Lots of shiny new cars
and plenty of older cars too. Great assortment in this photo!

The "FHIX" stood for Fruit Growers Express, High Insulation" -- there
were also WHIX cars for Western Fruit Express. These cars had 33% more
cubic capacity than conventional 40 foot ice reefers.

Tim

P.S. If you need some photos of roof paint failure I can send you some. :-)