Resin Kits w/cast-on grabs/ladders
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Bill Welch
To clarify why this option would be offered, the kits are intended for those needing to build fleets of a certain prototype, especially gons and hoppers. IIRC one of the intended kits is a one-piece composite CB&Q gon offered as a kit years ago by Sunshine. Bill Welch
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David
Anyone in that much of a hurry could simply build the cars without installing the grabs and other superdetail bits. Casting blob "grabs" just makes extra unnecessary work for people who do have the time.
David Thompson
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Pierre Oliver
I have seen the initial "patterns" for
these models and the cast on grabs are not "blobs".
Rather they are reasonably fine representations of grabs. The models are targeted for a specific market, that is the person/s who require a large fleet of a certain class of car and doesn't wish to spend the time "superdetailing" them. With a good paint job and a nice touch of weathering these cars will pass muster in an operating layout environment. Not for everyone, but certainly will appeal to more than a few, I'm sure. Pierre Oliver www.elgincarshops.com www.yarmouthmodelworks.comOn 2/12/2015 11:10 AM, jaydeet2001@... [STMFC] wrote:
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Maxine <burgerbits20@...>
Hi:this group buys resin cars because we want a certain level of detail, which includes seperate grab irons and ladders. There are numerous RTR cars and simple kits which are fast builds. I don't see the appeal of a lesser detailed resin kit. At best it precludes the production of a kit with greater detail depriving us of this model. Thanks. Marty cooper
On Feb 12, 2015, at 11:29 AM, Pierre Oliver pierre.oliver@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
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William Hirt
The CB&Q had over 6,000 of these gondolas so these are needed by
any Midwest transition modeler. A lot of southern Illinois coal was
moved in these cars to local coal dealers. Southern Illinois coal
also moved into the Dakotas and Minnesota from the Q to GN and NP,
so even modelers in that area could justify having one or two of
these cars. A friend put together three of the Sunshine kits for me
and I consider them the stars of my freight car fleet. Considering
they are no longer available from Sunshine, and I would be very
surprised to see them in plastic, I would look forward to a resin
kit which would speed construction of at least another dozen or so.
There are no ladders on these cars, only grab irons.
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Bill Hirt
On 2/12/2015 1:31 PM, Maxine
burgerbits20@... [STMFC] wrote:
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Benjamin Hom
Marty Cooper wrote:
"...this group buys resin cars because we want a certain level of detail, which includes seperate grab irons and ladders." That's missing the forest for the trees. I buy resin kits because they offer prototypes that wouldn't otherwise be available in injection molded plastic due to limited appeal. Don't fall into the trap that "it's more accurate model because it's a resin kit". That's certainly not the case. Ben Hom
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Pierre Oliver
LOL Ben.
Well said. Pierre Oliver www.elgincarshops.com www.yarmouthmodelworks.comOn 2/12/2015 3:42 PM, Benjamin Hom b.hom@... [STMFC] wrote:
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And, really, how hard would it be to shave off the cast-in grabs, anyway?
Thanks! -- Brian Ehni From: STMFC List <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Reply-To: STMFC List <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Date: Thursday, February 12, 2015 at 2:42 PM To: STMFC List <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Resin Kits w/cast-on grabs/ladders Marty Cooper wrote: "...this group buys resin cars because we want a certain level of detail, which includes seperate grab irons and ladders." That's missing the forest for the trees. I buy resin kits because they offer prototypes that wouldn't otherwise be available in injection molded plastic due to limited appeal. Don't fall into the trap that "it's more accurate model because it's a resin kit". That's certainly not the case. Ben Hom [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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I sold my Sunshine 33.x kits last year for $37 each... I guess now I should have held out for more money! :-) They were certainly beautiful kits and since Frank did the masters I'm sure his 1-piece bodies will be very good too, albeit probably for more than Sunshine's original $36 price. Tim O'Connor
The CB&Q had over 6,000 of these gondolas so these are needed by any Midwest transition modeler. A lot of southern Illinois coal was moved in these cars to local coal dealers. Southern Illinois coal also moved into the Dakotas and Minnesota from the Q to GN and NP, so even modelers in that area could justify having one or two of these cars. A friend put together three of the Sunshine kits for me and I consider them the stars of my freight car fleet. Considering they are no longer available from Sunshine, and I would be very surprised to see them in plastic, I would look forward to a resin kit which would speed construction of at least another dozen or so. There are no ladders on these cars, only grab irons.
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tyesac@...
Why not just provide NBW and a drilling location dimple? I would think a "large fleet" buyer would also prefer buying prepainted, un numbered cars anyway, and not care much about grab irons either way.
I prefer to avoid the carving chore for grabs and ladders and the gon in question has what, 12 or so grabs in total? I recently carved off the ladders, brake platform hand brake and grabs from a Bowser round roof 40' single door car and that was a pain! Wound up making a nice N&W B-1 though.
Tom Casey
-----Original Message----- From: Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC] To: STMFC Sent: Thu, Feb 12, 2015 3:48 pm Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Resin Kits w/cast-on grabs/ladders I sold my Sunshine 33.x kits last year for $37 each... I guess now I should have held out for more money! :-) They were certainly beautiful kits and since Frank did the masters I'm sure his 1-piece bodies will be very good too, albeit probably for more than Sunshine's original $36 price. Tim O'Connor The CB&Q had over 6,000 of these gondolas so these are needed by any Midwest transition modeler. A lot of southern Illinois coal was moved in these cars to local coal dealers. Southern Illinois coal also moved into the Dakotas and Minnesota from the Q to GN and NP, so even modelers in that area could justify having one or two of these cars. A friend put together three of the Sunshine kits for me and I consider them the stars of my freight car fleet. Considering they are no longer available from Sunshine, and I would be very surprised to see them in plastic, I would look forward to a resin kit which would speed construction of at least another dozen or so. There are no ladders on these cars, only grab irons.
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Tom Madden
Everyone is missing the point. Frank has made a business decision to offer simplified cast resin models to those who want models not available in plastic but who lack the skill or time to deal with traditional resin kits. It's not an either/or situation - the alternative is not a high end resin kit, it's not offering one at all. It's kind of an elitist attitude, don't you think, to suggest that resin kit manufacturers tailor all their offerings exclusively to those of us with the skills to assemble anything Westerfield, Sunshine or Speedwitch ever produced. We're a very tiny part of the hobby market, so anything which might inspire modelers in the "next level down" to join our ranks should be encouraged. The modeler who assembles four IC chisel-sided hoppers from Frank in the time it takes me to do one of Sunshine's might well decide to tackle a more complex resin kit next time. That enlarges the market for all of us, which should be a good thing. Tom Madden.
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Greg Martin
Bill and all,
I think it is a grand idea.
To echo Tom's remarks it should be regarded as a stepping stone for the
modeler.
How many of us bought the ACCURAIL gondola when it cam out? Resin is just
the choice of way the model is produced not the culture of the modeler. What you
decide to do with it after you get it is truly up to you, isn't it?
I think there is a good market for it, but it may be price sensitive at
first but it will have a following. I trust that Frank's soul will be there in the level of detail.
Only a few know how many of Aaron Gjermundson's resin ends and sills
were sold for last years(2014) SHAKE_N_TAKE kits and there is still an
interest in them.
Hell, this might just be the first resin kit I finish...
3^) (wink wink Bill ~ just kidding)
Greg Martin
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through
it. Norman Maclean
In a message dated 2/12/2015 6:56:10 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
STMFC@... writes:
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Bill Welch
Elitist and i will add "Entitled" Tom, I totally agree with what you are saying. I might even buy the IC hopper and decal it for the NC&StL and ignore the fact that the length is not quite correct, but then I also prefer the Tichy 2-bay hopper. Shudder, call the Prototype Police.
Bill Welch
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Clark Propst
Frank has always been in the admirable position of being able to make
masters for cars he wanted. His personal line is no different. He needs lots of
certain types of cars for his layout and doesn’t want to invent a ton of time
assembling models. I think he’s been mulling this approach over for a few years.
If no one buys them, he’ll just have more for himself ; ))
Clark
Propst Mason City Iowa
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Jim King
I agree with Frank’s idea. Resin kits scare a lot of would-be builders, just like piles of etched brass sheets in a diesel kit do.
With a little ingenuity, which Frank has in abundance, the ladder stiles and rungs can be designed with tapered sides that help create the illusion of separate pieces. That’s 1 of the many advantages of using rubber molds vs. traditional metal molds: negatively drafted, shallow features mean nothing. If properly done, looking dead-on to the model will look just fine. Only shadows may allude to something else but careful weathering can hide some of that too.
Good for you, Frank!
Jim King (828) 777-5619 www.smokymountainmodelworks.com
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Hi,
Thought I'd point out a detail that may be affecting the widely varied responses to Frank's decision ... It's a good idea (to me) to offer different products with different target buyers. And anything that gets more guys building models with increased accuracy/level of detailing/etc. is also a good idea. Here's a piece of evidence supporting that ... even one of the most skilled builders we all know (Richard H.) had a large quantity of UNbuilt resin models in his "hobby shop in the closet". Perhaps even because they are resin kits - our resin models seem to be easy to "buy more than you will ever build". Who amongst us can say he doesn't have a supply of resin kits that he couldn't finish in a year if he did nothing else but work on those kits and focused on just that as his 'only' modeling activity? So if a resin mfgr was to offer some long missing car - such as the flat car recently mentioned - but to do it -only- in the cast on grabs version ... then those of us wanting the same car but who don't want cast on grabs ===> are left wanting. Perhaps the correct solution would be to offer the cast on grabs version only as an alternative to an already produced model in that resin mfgr's line? If the mfgr can 'rework' his line and issue the cast on grabs versions of even his products that are long out of production - there is the possibility that he can increase his business with much less time/effort. - Jim
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Tony Thompson
Jim Betz wrote:
Perhaps even because they are resin kits - our resin models seem to be easy to "buy more than you will ever build". Who amongst us can say he doesn't have a supply of resin kits that he couldn't finish in a year if he did nothing else but work on those kits and focused on just that as his 'only' modeling activity? Me, for one, and I bet Clark Propst is the same. I simply realized I wanted to change being in the place you describe, Jim, and have built, traded or had someone build, essentially all the resin kits I had. I think there are three, maybe four, still here. Most of my 60 or so kits were traded or sold, but many were indeed built. This was one area where I did not particularly want to "die with the most unbuilt kits." Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com Publishers of books on railroad history
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steel77086@...
Tom,
I'm with you (and Frank Hodina). I do not have unlimited time
just for resin kit building,besides all the other facets of layout building
(locomotives,structures,scenery,etc.). My wife's recent death also has
me thinking about how much time I have left on this planet. In
addition, I already have some resin cars waiting to be assembled, but I
also have cars produced which have molded on but thin profile grabs, so I
can live with that if it means getting something not already produced by the
bigger firms in this business. I look forward to his new products.
Vince Altiere
In a message dated 2/13/2015 1:10:43 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
STMFC@... writes:
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Armand Premo
Begs the question,what are some of those missing cars?I'll bet that the list would vary greatly with individual modelers.Armand Premo
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----- Original Message -----
From: "jimbetz jimbetz@jimbetz.com [STMFC]" <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 12:01 PM Subject: [STMFC] Re: Resin Kits w/cast-on grabs/ladders Hi,
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Pierre Oliver
Really Armand?
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Way to kick over the can. :-) Pierre Oliver www.elgincarshops.com www.yarmouthmodelworks.com
On 2/13/2015 2:59 PM, 'Armand' armprem2@surfglobal.net [STMFC] wrote:
Begs the question,what are some of those missing cars?I'll bet that the list
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