Air Erasers or Abrasion Guns


Bill Welch
 

I have a small Badger Abrasion Gun that I use mainly for spraying Baking Soda to prep styrene and resin models before I paint. During my most recent etching ritual it became clogged and the usual cleaning steps did not clear it. I got frustrated and put it up and plan to completely disassemble it today to try to sort it out but I also went online today to see what is out there. TCP Global shows some Chinese Guns that I will look more closely at but I wanted to ask folks here if the have experience with either of these Passche Models:


Paasche Airbrush LAC#3 Abrasive Spray Gun

The above seems simpler than this model:

Paasche AECR Remote Air Eraser Etching Tool

The hose arrangement seems complex to me. Can anyone comment on the tip sizes and if they come in different sizes?


Not worried about cost exactly, and if the Chinese tools seem viable, I might go that way. Mainly concerned about support and parts and Passche has good rep for both.


Would love to know what others are using. Thanks!


Bill Welch


Dave Parker
 

Maybe jumping ahead here, but last year I bought one of the Chinese ones from MicroMark for $70 (MicroLux Mini Sandblast Gun Set).  Seems to work fine with the supplied Al oxide powder, no complaints thus far.  As for sodium bicarb, um, why?  Seems like an unnecessary complication.

Dave Parker
Riverside, Ca
 


Bill Welch
 

Because Baking Soda works and is cheap so why not?

Bill Welch


Dave Parker
 

Your original post would seem to answer "why not?". 

Dave Parker


Bill Welch
 

I think the issue not about the media but the very inexpensive air eraser. Many people use Baking Soda. I am  willing to be educated to the contrary however.

Bill Welch


Douglas Harding
 

I have used baking soda because it is not as abrasive, and thus allows me to remove lettering without removing the underlying paint. Great if you are just wanting to renumber or reletter a car, but not completely strip it.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 


A&Y Dave in MD
 

And it's biodegradable so less problem if you inhale.

Sent from Dave Bott' iPhone

On Mar 12, 2015, at 1:34 PM, fgexbill@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

Because Baking Soda works and is cheap so why not?


Bill Welch


boomer44@...
 

I have the Paasche Air Eraser (AEC) but mine uses an enclosed cup. It looks just like a regular airbrush. I used baking soda until the tip kept clogging. Turns out the baking soda was turning the inside of the tip green with built up corrosion. I now use only aluminum oxide with no problems.

Gordon


T.J. Stratton
 

Bill,
 
I just purchased a Harbor Freight Air Eraser for $28.00. I have a small Sears air compressor with a 3 gallon air tank.  I was ready for a let down.  I put it together and plugged in the compressor.  Worked like a charm!  I used it on two cars and I'm impressed with the results. The rest of my set up was a leather work glove to hold the car and a 30 garbage can to collect the media. Quite an extravagant set up!  A small media blasting cabinet will be my next addition. 

TJ Stratton Maumee, OH. "Modeling the 1950's branch lines of the Michigan Central Railroad in southern Michigan" Mailto:michigancentralrr@...
 

To: STMFC@...
From: STMFC@...
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2015 08:49:19 -0700
Subject: [STMFC] Air Erasers or Abrasion Guns

 

I have a small Badger Abrasion Gun that I use mainly for spraying Baking Soda to prep styrene and resin models before I paint. During my most recent etching ritual it became clogged and the usual cleaning steps did not clear it. I got frustrated and put it up and plan to completely disassemble it today to try to sort it out but I also went online today to see what is out there. TCP Global shows some Chinese Guns that I will look more closely at but I wanted to ask folks here if the have experience with either of these Passche Models:


Paasche Airbrush LAC#3 Abrasive Spray Gun

The above seems simpler than this model:
Paasche AECR Remote Air Eraser Etching Tool

The hose arrangement seems complex to me. Can anyone comment on the tip sizes and if they come in different sizes?


Not worried about cost exactly, and if the Chinese tools seem viable, I might go that way. Mainly concerned about support and parts and Passche has good rep for both.


Would love to know what others are using. Thanks!


Bill Welch


Bill Welch
 

Be sure to wear a good mask T.J. I will give the HB gun a look. What I like about the Passche LAC#3 is it has a good size media container. Which Blast Cabinet are you looking at?

Bill Welch


Bill Welch
 

The Badger is mostly plastic but maybe i will see something when I get it apart. The AO is abrasive enough to make the gun self-cleaning I suppose.

Bill Welch


Carl Gustafson
 

I have a Paasche Air Eraser. I load it with baking soda, both for price and reduced abrasivity. I use
it for both cleanup after stripping paint, if it doesn't all come off, removing any oxide and putting
a tooth on brass parts prior to painting, and weathering.

I've found that hitting delrin trucks with the baking soda roughens up the surface, makes it a nice,
weathered black, and leaves it with enough surface irregularities to hold paint quite well. Good for
railings, too, I suppose, but haven't used it for that (yet).

After using, if I don't give it a thorough cleaning, I notice that the trigger starts to stick or get
hard to use.

Finally, I use it outside, standing upwind. I've got some holders for trucks, so I take a batch, and
can do a batch and not have to get my fingers near the truck, so no need for gloves.

I'm quite pleased with mine.

Carl "Gritty" Gustafson


Jack Burgess
 

I wrote an article which was in the Feb 2012 issue of RMC on building your own blast booth using a plastic storage box. Let me know if any of you want a copy.



Jack Burgess

jack@...



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2015 1:27 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Air Erasers or Abrasion Guns





The Badger is mostly plastic but maybe i will see something when I get it apart. The AO is abrasive enough to make the gun self-cleaning I suppose.



Bill Welch










[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Bill Welch
 

Thanks Carl:

This has been my routine but I am finding myself getting tired of carrying my compressor outside and also waiting until I have a batch of things to etch. Plus I get covered with a haze of baking soda, LOL, so along with a new air eraser tool I am contemplating a simple cabinat so I can do everything inside when and do things as I ready instead of in batches.

I did completely disassemble my little gun and found not obstruction so this weekend I will do a batch of things and continue to evaluate. Need to add Baking soda to grocery list.

Bill Welch


Dave Parker
 

I have never tried baking soda, so I have no experience, but can offer these comments:

1.  Sodium bicarbonate is rather hygroscopic which is why, when you leave it in your fridge for a few months, it can turn into a cake.  Probably not an issue here in California but, if I still lived on the east coast, I would avoid it for this reason alone.

2.  Sodium bicarbonate is a "weak" abrasive. It has a Mohs hardness rating of 2.5, lower than that of many plastics.  Maybe a good choice for removing decals, but I can't see any advantage if you really want to clean/prep plastic or (especially) brass.

3.  "Aluminum oxide" could refer to several different things, but the stuff offered by Paasche is supposed to etch glass effectively, so it probably has a Mohs rating of 9 (i.e., a really effective abrasive).  I can buy 5 lbs of the Paasche product on Amazon for $22.50 (w/ free shipping), probably enough to prep 1000 cars, so I cannot see how cost is an issue here.

4. Sodium bicarbonate is inorganic, so it cannot be "biodegradable".  It is water-soluble (unlike Al oxide), but inhalation hazards are first and foremost a function of particle size, not chemical composition.  The smaller the particle, the worse it is for your health.

Probably enough chemistry for today.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA


North Model Railroad Supplies <nmrs@...>
 

As for sodium bicarb, um, why?  Seems like an unnecessary complication.
Dave ParkerRiverside, Ca

Hi Dave,

Sodium bicarb is less aggressive than alum oxide so you can often remove lettering without removing the paint underneath.

Also you can use sodium bicarb outside as it is biodegradable.

Cheers

Dave North

 

 

 


A&Y Dave in MD
 

I used the wrong term in biodegradable. Small amounts of sodium bicarbonate can be absorbed in the lung mucus and then excreted, whereas aluminum oxide would not and would create longer lasting and more deleterious effects in the lungs as the body tried to get rid of it. Size always matters and I typically wear a filter mask and would never recommend inhaling large clouds of any particulate, but in the trace amounts you might inhale even with precautions biochemistry matters too. I'd rather inhale a small amount of sodium bicarbonate than aluminum oxide. Your preferences may vary.

Despite the numbers on the MOHs scale, sodium bicarbonate has been effective for me in removing decals and paint from styrene and brass on my models. I probably should etch for better adhesion, but I haven't.

And despite being on the east coast, I have not had much clogging. FYI, I use a Paasche air eraser, but really infrequently. If I buy aluminum oxide and a booth, they take up storage space. On the infrequent occasion I need to remove paint or decals, I can go into my wife's box, which she keeps for removing minor sink clogs or odors in trash cans. So it's a multi-task material, easily available and with less opportunity costs than Al oxide abrasive. Others will have far higher volumes and a dedicated cabinet and a recycled abrasive material would make far greater sense.

Most paint removal for me is on a loco, and decal removal even on freight cars is rare. I tend to need resin kits or kit bashing for my freight cars, so relative to this list topic, I find an air eraser and bicarb out on my picnic table with a mask is sufficient.

Your mileage WILL vary.

Dave

Sent from Dave Bott's iPad

On Mar 12, 2015, at 7:39 PM, Dave Parker spottab@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

4. Sodium bicarbonate is inorganic, so it cannot be "biodegradable". It is water-soluble (unlike Al oxide), but inhalation hazards are first and foremost a function of particle size, not chemical composition. The smaller the particle, the worse it is for your health.


mwbauers
 

WEAR A MASK !!!

You will otherwise be inhaling fragments of decals, paint, and sometimes rust. A safer blast medium is not your only concern.

Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Mar 12, 2015, at 8:22 PM, David bott wrote:

I used the wrong term in biodegradable. Small amounts of sodium bicarbonate can be absorbed in the lung mucus and then excreted, whereas aluminum oxide would not and would create longer lasting and more deleterious effects in the lungs as the body tried to get rid of it. Size always matters and I typically wear a filter mask and would never recommend inhaling large clouds of any particulate, but in the trace amounts you might inhale even with precautions biochemistry matters too. I'd rather inhale a small amount of sodium bicarbonate than aluminum oxide. Your preferences may vary.

Despite the numbers on the MOHs scale, sodium bicarbonate has been effective for me in removing decals and paint from styrene and brass on my models. .................


Misc Clark
 

Jack - your blast booth from a storage box sounds interesting...may I get a copy of the article you wrote about it?
Thanks,
Clark Cone

On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 5:08 PM, 'Jack Burgess' jack@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

I wrote an article which was in the Feb 2012 issue of RMC on building your own blast booth using a plastic storage box. Let me know if any of you want a copy.

Jack Burgess

jack@...

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2015 1:27 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Air Erasers or Abrasion Guns

The Badger is mostly plastic but maybe i will see something when I get it apart. The AO is abrasive enough to make the gun self-cleaning I suppose.

Bill Welch

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



john.allyn@...
 

What kind of mask do you recommend/use? 

John Allyn


From: "Mike Bauers mwbauers55@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Friday, March 13, 2015 12:02:49 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Air Erasers or Abrasion Guns

 

WEAR A MASK !!!


You will otherwise be inhaling fragments of decals, paint, and sometimes rust. A safer blast medium is not your only concern.

Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Mar 12, 2015, at 8:22 PM, David bott wrote:

I used the wrong term in biodegradable. Small amounts of sodium bicarbonate can be absorbed in the lung mucus and then excreted, whereas aluminum oxide would not and would create longer lasting and more deleterious effects in the lungs as the body tried to get rid of it. Size always matters and I typically wear a filter mask and would never recommend inhaling large clouds of any particulate, but in the trace amounts you might inhale even with precautions biochemistry matters too. I'd rather inhale a small amount of sodium bicarbonate than aluminum oxide. Your preferences may vary.

Despite the numbers on the MOHs scale, sodium bicarbonate has been effective for me in removing decals and paint from styrene and brass on my models. .................