L&N hopper far from home


D. Scott Chatfield
 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Trona-Caboose-100-Black-White-Photo-/111879967907?


I've heard of CF&I in Pueblo buying coke from Chattanooga which arrived in L&N hoppers, but Searles, California? Surely pet coke from Pittsburg, CA would be cheaper after you consider shipping charges. Hmmmm

And if it's just a load of coal, that would be even harder to explain.

It probably didn't get to the Mojave by way of Sherman Hill, so Mike is safe.....

Really interesting caboose too. Built from a short passenger car maybe?

Scott Chatfield


Tony Thompson
 

Scott Chatfield wrote:

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Trona-Caboose-100-Black-White-Photo-/111879967907?

I've heard of CF&I in Pueblo buying coke from Chattanooga which arrived
in L&N hoppers, but Searles, California? Surely pet coke from
Pittsburg, CA would be cheaper after you consider shipping charges. Hmmmm

And if it's just a load of coal, that would be even harder to explain.


     Wish RIchard were here to comment -- I can just hear him say, "logic can be so disappointing, can't it, Scott? But freight cars just went everywhere, even when logic does not seem to explain it."

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Todd Horton
 

I have photo shot by Jim Parker of a C of Ga two bay open hopper in Toronto in the 1950's. I've often wondered what it was carrying to be that far from home rails.
 
Todd Horton


From: "Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2016 3:52 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] L&N hopper far from home

 
Scott Chatfield wrote:

 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Trona-Caboose-100-Black-White-Photo-/111879967907?

I've heard of CF&I in Pueblo buying coke from Chattanooga which arrived
in L&N hoppers, but Searles, California? Surely pet coke from
Pittsburg, CA would be cheaper after you consider shipping charges. Hmmmm

And if it's just a load of coal, that would be even harder to explain.

     Wish RIchard were here to comment -- I can just hear him say, "logic can be so disappointing, can't it, Scott? But freight cars just went everywhere, even when logic does not seem to explain it."

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history







Todd Sullivan
 

I know from conversations and photographic evidence that foreign road cars didn't always get sent homeward promptly when empty.  Sometimes, they were 'borrowed' for loading and sent wherever the load was going.  There are photos of short coal trains on the PRR's Schuylkill Valley Branch above Pottsville, PA that have 80% foreign road hoppers.  Maybe this L&N hopper was loaded to a Midwestern point when there was a shortage of hoppers, and got borrowed for loading and sent further west.

Todd Sullivan
Liverpool, NY


Tim O'Connor
 

Eastern hoppers were common in Provo UT, not just Pueblo CO, loaded
with met coal. This one probably was reloaded at one of the mines in
Utah or western Colorado, and THAT source of coal was an everyday commodity
delivered to industries in the Mojave desert, often by way of Donner Pass.

Tim O'Connor

P.S. never saw a Trona caboose before!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Trona-Caboose-100-Black-White-Photo-/111879967907?

I've heard of CF&I in Pueblo buying coke from Chattanooga which arrived
in L&N hoppers, but Searles, California? Surely pet coke from
Pittsburg, CA would be cheaper after you consider shipping charges. Hmmmm

And if it's just a load of coal, that would be even harder to explain.

It probably didn't get to the Mojave by way of Sherman Hill, so Mike is
safe.....

Really interesting caboose too. Built from a short passenger car maybe?

Scott Chatfield


rdgbuff56
 

One of the Color Guides has a photo of a wreck in Montana in 1955 that includes a Reading hopper.

Francis A. Pehowic, Jr.
Sunbury, Pa.

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

From:"Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC]"
Date:Mon, Jan 25, 2016 at 11:55 pm
Subject:Re: [STMFC] L&N hopper far from home

 


Eastern hoppers were common in Provo UT, not just Pueblo CO, loaded
with met coal. This one probably was reloaded at one of the mines in
Utah or western Colorado, and THAT source of coal was an everyday commodity
delivered to industries in the Mojave desert, often by way of Donner Pass.

Tim O'Connor

P.S. never saw a Trona caboose before!

>http://www.ebay.com/itm/Trona-Caboose-100-Black-White-Photo-/111879967907?
>
>I've heard of CF&I in Pueblo buying coke from Chattanooga which arrived
>in L&N hoppers, but Searles, California? Surely pet coke from
>Pittsburg, CA would be cheaper after you consider shipping charges. Hmmmm
>
>And if it's just a load of coal, that would be even harder to explain.
>
>It probably didn't get to the Mojave by way of Sherman Hill, so Mike is
>safe.....
>
>Really interesting caboose too. Built from a short passenger car maybe?
>
>Scott Chatfield


Tim O'Connor
 


Anthracite, most likely. Looking into this, I discovered that Washington state
has large coal deposits (estimated at over 50 billion tons) including ANTHRACITE
in an area north of Seattle that was served by the Milwaukee Road -- but the
field was undeveloped as of 1943.

Tim O'Connor


 One of the Color Guides has a photo of a wreck in Montana in 1955 that includes a Reading hopper.
 Francis A. Pehowic, Jr.
 Sunbury, Pa.


Tony Thompson
 

Francis A. Pehowic, Jr. wrote:

 

One of the Color Guides has a photo of a wreck in Montana in 1955 that includes a Reading hopper.


        At this point in this annual topic, I often point out that I have a color slide of an empty Reading hopper on SP rails in Los Angeles in 1959. Likely moving anthracite used in water treatment.
Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





drgwrail
 

Back some 30 years ago when I was working on an LV book I had a talk with a fellow who was a retired yardmaster of the LV  Coxton Yard..n

At the time I had a theory that the anthracite railroads had placed their hopper cars in some sort of pool since the business was declining and they didn't want to buy more cars.This was base on my observations and examining colliery photos.

The guy laughed at that saying that there wasn't much cooperation between railroads and if they needed cars the simply stored the other railroad's car until the LV needed them.As for the rules about sending off line cars back to their owners, they paid no attention to them and "violations were a problem for upper management to deal with". 

Todd, I am still here in Colorado and living in a retirement facility. Have lost all contact with the NY guys. Drop me a line. I am still at raildata@....

Chuck Yungkurth
Louisdville CO



Louis Van Winkle
 

Lettering for modern freight cars is sprayed on using a stencil.
How about back in say 1900, was lettering stenciled on to a car, or would it have been hand painted ?

Lou Van Winkle

On Tue, Jan 26, 2016 at 2:55 PM, drgwrail@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

Back some 30 years ago when I was working on an LV book I had a talk with a fellow who was a retired yardmaster of the LV  Coxton Yard..n


At the time I had a theory that the anthracite railroads had placed their hopper cars in some sort of pool since the business was declining and they didn't want to buy more cars.This was base on my observations and examining colliery photos.

The guy laughed at that saying that there wasn't much cooperation between railroads and if they needed cars the simply stored the other railroad's car until the LV needed them.As for the rules about sending off line cars back to their owners, they paid no attention to them and "violations were a problem for upper management to deal with". 

Todd, I am still here in Colorado and living in a retirement facility. Have lost all contact with the NY guys. Drop me a line. I am still at raildata@....

Chuck Yungkurth
Louisdville CO




Tony Thompson
 

Lou Van Winkle wrote:

 
Lettering for modern freight cars is sprayed on using a stencil.
How about back in say 1900, was lettering stenciled on to a car, or would it have been hand painted ?

    Certainly by World War I, and I believe earlier, stencils were used, then painters filled in the "stencil gaps" by hand.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Dave Parker
 

I would concur with Tony, but would have said 'then some painters filled in the "stencil gaps" by hand.'

I have more than a couple of pre-WWII photos where the stencil gaps can be clearly seen in lettering 4" and smaller.  But generally not in the 7+" lettering, although there are exceptions to every rule.

Dave Parker
Riverside CA


Tony Thompson
 

Dave Parker wrote:

 
I would concur with Tony, but would have said 'then some painters filled in the "stencil gaps" by hand.'

I have more than a couple of pre-WWII photos where the stencil gaps can be clearly seen in lettering 4" and smaller.  But generally not in the 7+" lettering, although there are exceptions to every rule..


       Good point, Dave, and I agree. I only wanted to observe that "non-stencil" letters were not hand-painted entirely. I would add that leaving stencil gaps varies from railroad to railroad, and depends also on era.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Dave Parker
 

Tony:

Based on my rather small corner in space (the NE) and time (the mid-1930s), I am tempted to say "varied from painter to painter".  I dunno, maybe the  B&M painters were really enjoying their Guinness (or whatever was available back then), but it seems much easier to find multiple cars that were lettered differently than even two that were exactly the same.

Of course, this makes my life easier when working up (or buying) decals:  "close enough  is good enough" is a helpful motto when you have a handful (at most) of prototype photos to represent a car series numbering in the hundreds or (sometimes) the low thousands.  As always, YMMV.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA




On Tuesday, January 26, 2016 7:25 PM, "Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
Dave Parker wrote:

 
I would concur with Tony, but would have said 'then some painters filled in the "stencil gaps" by hand.'

I have more than a couple of pre-WWII photos where the stencil gaps can be clearly seen in lettering 4" and smaller.  But generally not in the 7+" lettering, although there are exceptions to every rule..


       Good point, Dave, and I agree. I only wanted to observe that "non-stencil" letters were not hand-painted entirely. I would add that leaving stencil gaps varies from railroad to railroad, and depends also on era.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history







Dennis Storzek
 




---In STMFC@..., <tony@...> wrote :



    Certainly by World War I, and I believe earlier, stencils were used, then painters filled in the "stencil gaps" by hand.
===================

It was also possible to use lengths of wire in place of the stencil bars; this was often done when the stencils were made of sheet metal. The relatively thin round wire allowed the paint to flow around and under them, so there were no gaps to touch up, although on a newly stenciled car you could see the marks the wires left in the paint surface.

For those wondering, before the days when spray painting was common, stenciling was commonly done with "stencil brushes" round short bristled things that looked like stiff shaving brushes, used with a stippling motion. The paint used was commonly called "stencil paste" and was heavier bodied and less runny than standard paint. It was slow drying and tended to self level as it dried.

Dennis Storzek


midrly
 

Probably CN company service coal for the Spadina or Mimico roundhouse. 

Steve Lucas.