NYCSHS Central Headlight 2nd Qtr 2016 - NYC Automobile Cars 1916


 

Go to the NYCSHS website.  Copies of the Central Headlight can be purchased, probably through the Collinwood Shop.  Over the years some excellent articles on NYC freight cars have been published.  An index to the Central Headlight is also available.  Hugh T Guillaume, former board member of the NYCSHS

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


Schleigh Mike
 

Ben Hohm has wisely advised that the NYC auto cars would and did logically deliver new cars to a dealer near your modeled railroad.  Another frequently found application for older, smaller auto cars is that they were re-classed into general XM boxcar service.  This would bring on 'free-roaming' as these cars might find suitable assignments wherever they next were found empty.  "Merchandise"or LCL opportunities were good because such cars would often not need full cubic or weight capacity as opposed to adequate floor space for many various cartons and crates.  In such service, doors beyond the basic single left and right would often (but not necessarily) be "sealed" to render them inoperative.  Two NYC likely one-time auto cars (194949 and 198541) were in March of 1956 delivering green hides to Coudersport, Penna., having been loaded in Detroit, Mich.  There are lots of opportunity for former auto cars and many more for those older, lower capacity NYC house cars.

Happy diverse model railroading!
Mike Schleigh from Grove City in the western fringes of Pennsylvania


On Friday, May 20, 2016 6:52 PM, "Hugh mguill1224@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
Go to the NYCSHS website.  Copies of the Central Headlight can be purchased, probably through the Collinwood Shop.  Over the years some excellent articles on NYC freight cars have been published.  An index to the Central Headlight is also available.  Hugh T Guillaume, former board member of the NYCSHS
 
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
 



Matt Goodman
 

I've seen several references to sealing or removing one of the doors in auto cars. Why was this done?  I would think the large opening would be useful for more than just autos. 

As a side question, it would seem to me that autos are a relatively light load for the volume they occupy. We're auto cars sprung differently (i.e. softer) because of this?

Matt Goodman
Columbus, Ohio

Sent from my mobile

On May 20, 2016, at 7:47 PM, Schleigh Mike mike_schleigh@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

Ben Hohm has wisely advised that the NYC auto cars would and did logically deliver new cars to a dealer near your modeled railroad.  Another frequently found application for older, smaller auto cars is that they were re-classed into general XM boxcar service.  This would bring on 'free-roaming' as these cars might find suitable assignments wherever they next were found empty.  "Merchandise"or LCL opportunities were good because such cars would often not need full cubic or weight capacity as opposed to adequate floor space for many various cartons and crates.  In such service, doors beyond the basic single left and right would often (but not necessarily) be "sealed" to render them inoperative.  Two NYC likely one-time auto cars (194949 and 198541) were in March of 1956 delivering green hides to Coudersport, Penna., having been loaded in Detroit, Mich.  There are lots of opportunity for former auto cars and many more for those older, lower capacity NYC house cars.

Happy diverse model railroading!
Mike Schleigh from Grove City in the western fringes of Pennsylvania


On Friday, May 20, 2016 6:52 PM, "Hugh mguill1224@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:


 
Go to the NYCSHS website.  Copies of the Central Headlight can be purchased, probably through the Collinwood Shop.  Over the years some excellent articles on NYC freight cars have been published.  An index to the Central Headlight is also available.  Hugh T Guillaume, former board member of the NYCSHS
 
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
 



Benjamin Hom
 

Matt Goodman asked:
"I've seen several references to sealing or removing one of the doors in auto cars. Why was this done?  I would think the large opening would be useful for more than just autos."

It's one less thing to maintain, and this usually coincided with the availability of newer cars with double doors, making the older cars obsolete for their original service, and the fact that there was always a great demand for general service boxcars.  For example, the N&W Class BP automobile boxcars were a related design to PRR Class X28 - steel door-and-a-half automobile boxcars built during the 1920s with relatively small cubic capacities (9 ft 3 in IH).  Made obsolete as automobile boxcars by the widespread adoption of Evans Auto Racks, both classes were eventually rebuilt into general service boxcars, losing the auxiliary door and having the opening sheathed over.  While PRR rebuilt the cars to Class X28A during their 1930s car rebuilding programs (Class X24 automobile cars to K7A stock cars; Class X26 boxcar improvements), N&W didn't rebuild the cars immediately and ran them for a time with the doors sealed with stenciling noting that fact.  N&W did eventually remove and replace the doors, creating Class BPA.


Ben Hom


Dennis Storzek
 




---In STMFC@..., <goodman312@...> wrote :

I've seen several references to sealing or removing one of the doors in auto cars. Why was this done?  I would think the large opening would be useful for more than just autos. 
=================

One of the major commodities loaded in boxcasr was grain, and the wide door openings made the car unsuitable for grain loading. The wide door opening took twice as many grain doors, and twice as much work to cover, and was still more likely to leak.

Dennis Storzek



Eric Hansmann
 

Additionally, these 1916 double-sheathed NYC Lines automobile box cars were used on the Nickel Plate. They were the only 40-foot NKP box cars until steel cars were added to the NKP fleet in the 1930s. 


Eric Hansmann

El Paso, TX



On May 20, 2016 at 5:47 PM "Schleigh Mike mike_schleigh@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:

Ben Hohm has wisely advised that the NYC auto cars would and did logically deliver new cars to a dealer near your modeled railroad.  Another frequently found application for older, smaller auto cars is that they were re-classed into general XM boxcar service.  This would bring on 'free-roaming' as these cars might find suitable assignments wherever they next were found empty.  "Merchandise"or LCL opportunities were good because such cars would often not need full cubic or weight capacity as opposed to adequate floor space for many various cartons and crates.  In such service, doors beyond the basic single left and right would often (but not necessarily) be "sealed" to render them inoperative.  Two NYC likely one-time auto cars (194949 and 198541) were in March of 1956 delivering green hides to Coudersport, Penna., having been loaded in Detroit, Mich.  There are lots of opportunity for former auto cars and many more for those older, lower capacity NYC house cars.

Happy diverse model railroading!
Mike Schleigh from Grove City in the western fringes of Pennsylvania
 


On Friday, May 20, 2016 6:52 PM, "Hugh mguill1224@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:


 
 
Go to the NYCSHS website.  Copies of the Central Headlight can be purchased, probably through the Collinwood Shop.  Over the years some excellent articles on NYC freight cars have been published.  An index to the Central Headlight is also available.  Hugh T Guillaume, former board member of the NYCSHS
 
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
 
 



Armand Premo
 

Also the Rutland. I Believe Dennis Storzek produced these early resin models-.Armand Premo-------------------------------------------

On Sat, 5/21/16, Eric Hansmann eric@hansmanns.org [STMFC] <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: NYCSHS Central Headlight 2nd Qtr 2016 - NYC Automobile Cars 1916
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, May 21, 2016, 1:40 PM


 










Additionally, these 1916 double-sheathed NYC Lines
automobile box cars were used on the Nickel Plate. They were
the only 40-foot NKP box cars until steel cars were added to
the NKP fleet in the 1930s. 
Eric HansmannEl Paso,
TX

On May 20, 2016 at
5:47 PM "Schleigh Mike mike_schleigh@yahoo.com
[STMFC]" <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Ben
Hohm has wisely advised that the NYC auto cars would and did
logically deliver new cars to a dealer near your modeled
railroad.  Another frequently found application for older,
smaller auto cars is that they were re-classed into general
XM boxcar service.  This would bring on
'free-roaming' as these cars might find suitable
assignments wherever they next were found empty. 
"Merchandise"or LCL opportunities were good
because such cars would often not need full cubic or weight
capacity as opposed to adequate floor space for many various
cartons and crates.  In such service, doors beyond the
basic single left and right would often (but not
necessarily) be "sealed" to render them
inoperative.  Two NYC likely one-time auto cars (194949 and
198541) were in March of 1956 delivering green hides to
Coudersport, Penna., having been loaded in Detroit, Mich. 
There are lots of opportunity for former
auto cars and many more for those older, lower capacity NYC
house cars.
Happy
diverse model railroading!Mike
Schleigh from Grove City in the western fringes of
Pennsylvania
 



On Friday, May 20, 2016 6:52 PM, "Hugh
mguill1224@aol.com [STMFC]"
<STMFC@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


  
Go
to the NYCSHS website.  Copies of the Central Headlight can
be purchased, probably through the Collinwood Shop.  Over
the years some excellent articles on NYC freight cars have
been published.  An index to the Central Headlight is also
available.  Hugh T Guillaume, former board member of the
NYCSHS Sent
from Mail
for Windows 10   













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Dennis Storzek
 

But the Rutland cars were built new for the Rutland, and there were slight differences from the NYC cars, most likely not by design, but because they were built several years later. IIRC, all the NYC cars had 7/7 steel ends, while all the Rutland cars, both auto and single door box, had 6/8 ends of the same design.

Dennis Storzek


Armand Premo
 

You are absolutely correct, Dennis but the basic car is much the same deminsionally and in appearance.The NYC was in control of the Rutland and strongly influenced equipment design.
--------------------------------------------

On Sat, 5/21/16, destorzek@mchsi.com [STMFC] <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: NYCSHS Central Headlight 2nd Qtr 2016 - NYC Automobile Cars 1916
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, May 21, 2016, 2:51 PM


 









But the Rutland cars were built new for the
Rutland, and there were slight differences from the NYC
cars, most likely not by design, but because they were built
several years later. IIRC, all the NYC cars had 7/7 steel
ends, while all the Rutland cars, both auto and single door
box, had 6/8 ends of the same design.

Dennis Storzek









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Ray Breyer
 

Sealing the left hand doors on double sheathed auto boxcars was a cheap & fast way of downgrading them to plain boxcar and general freight handling. While there was some need for non-auto handling, double door boxcars rolling around, the overall need for those cars was small, while single door cars were in generally wide demand. Nailing the wood doors shut effectively made the former doors a part of the walls, and was FAST to do. If the car survived for a few years and got shopped, it wouldn't be unusual for the car to have a conventional wall added in it's place.

At least, that's what happened to the Nicklel plate's double sheathed auto cars, and to a few NYC and IC cars as well. Once the Depression hit and the need for auto carrying cars plummeted, the railroads first downgraded their older cars to general service, then nailed the left side doors shut, then eventually removed them completely (if they didn't scrap the cars completely). Roads like the Wabash just painted out 'AUTOMOBILE' on the sides of many of their cars instead of sealing the doors. By 1950 most of these cars were gone, replaced by steel XMs. About the only exception was the IC, which continued to run their wood-sides (single sheathed) ex-auto cars as hide, offal, and sludge cars well into the 1970s.
 
Ray Breyer
Elgin, IL




From: "destorzek@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2016 9:33 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: NYCSHS Central Headlight 2nd Qtr 2016 - NYC Automobile Cars 1916






---In STMFC@..., wrote :

I've seen several references to sealing or removing one of the doors in auto cars. Why was this done?  I would think the large opening would be useful for more than just autos. 
=================

One of the major commodities loaded in boxcasr was grain, and the wide door openings made the car unsuitable for grain loading. The wide door opening took twice as many grain doors, and twice as much work to cover, and was still more likely to leak.

Dennis Storzek







Benjamin Hom
 

Armand Premo wrote:
"Also the Rutland. I Believe Dennis Storzek produced these early resin models."

Correct.  Same prototypes are currently available from Westerfield in HO.

 





Tony Thompson
 

Ray Breyer wrote:

 
Sealing the left hand doors on double sheathed auto boxcars was a cheap & fast way of downgrading them to plain boxcar and general freight handling. While there was some need for non-auto handling, double door boxcars rolling around, the overall need for those cars was small, while single door cars were in generally wide demand. 

    While not in a position to dispute Ray's comment here as a general conclusion, I can offer a significant exception: the railroads that handled a lot of lumber used more of their double-door cars in that service than for automobiles, and as auto shipping in automobile cars decreased, were delighted to have more lumber cars available. Southern Pacific is one example. For years, system-wide equipment instructions specified sending all unneeded company double-door empties to Eugene for lumber loading. They were not about to disable those second doors!

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






Fran Giacoma
 

Enjoyed the subject article and would like to add a car to run on my HO 1956 B&O Shenandoah SD layout. I'd like to model the later (1940's) all steel, 40' car. What HO car would be a good starting point?

Thanks.

Fran Giacoma