Pivoted Machinery


thecitrusbelt@...
 

Pivoted Machinery

 

This looks like a placard:

 

http://prr.railfan.net/images/PivotedMachineryLadingCard_CT310.gif

 

But what best describes "pivoted machinery"?

 

Thanks.

 

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Michael Mang
 

"Derricks, steam shovels, and other pivoted machinery..." from the "Report of the Proceedings of the Executive Committee of the Master Car Builders Association, June 14, 1917". 

How do you keep those moving things from not moving during shipping, I suppose.

Michael Mang

On Tue, Sep 12, 2017 at 9:18 PM thecitrusbelt@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

Pivoted Machinery

 

This looks like a placard:

 

http://prr.railfan.net/images/PivotedMachineryLadingCard_CT310.gif

 

But what best describes "pivoted machinery"?

 

Thanks.

 

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


mark_landgraf
 

A pivoted machinery is usually considered to a rail mounted crane, or a pile driver, etc. The operating rules almost always call for the booms to be secured in the trailing position, so as to avoid creating a catapult situation while going down the track. 

Theoretically this could also apply to ‎equipment loaded on rr cars.  Think stuff like tracked excavators, either revenue or M of W. 

Mark Landgraf
Albany NY

From: thecitrusbelt@... [STMFC]
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 9:18 PM
To: STMFC@...
Reply To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Pivoted Machinery

 

Pivoted Machinery

 

This looks like a placard:

 

http://prr.railfan.net/images/PivotedMachineryLadingCard_CT310.gif

 

But what best describes "pivoted machinery"?

 

Thanks.

 

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


.


Dennis Storzek
 

Precisely. When loading things like power shovels (steam or otherwise) not only does the machine need to be secured to the car, but also the cab and boom secured to the car so it can't swing outside the clearance diagram.

Dennis Storzek


Dennis Storzek
 

Test
?


John Barry
 

Clear and Legible!
 
John Barry
 
ATSF North Bay Lines 
Golden Gates & Fast Freights 
Lovettsville, VA

707-490-9696 

PO Box 44736 
Washington, DC 20026-4736



From: "destorzek@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 10:05 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Pivoted Machinery

 
Test
?



Dennis Storzek
 

I know it's nice to have the last word, but this is ridiculous. I thought my message killed the forum :-)

Dennis Storzek


Tom Madden
 

Dennis wrote :
>
> I know it's nice to have the last word, but this is ridiculous.
> I thought my message killed the forum :-)

The group has been awfully quiet since our Florida members got taken off line by the hurricane. Bill Welch in Clearwater has resurfaced, but the east coast contingent hasn't. Any word from or about Mike Brock? A Merritt Island resident posted to another list yesterday that they were still without power, water, land line phones and internet. The Cocoa Beach Hilton's web site says they're closed until further notice due to a mandatory evacuation order. Nasty.....

Tom Madden


John C. La Rue, Jr. <MOFWCABOOSE@...>
 

Would have responded sooner but other matters have engaged my attention, and this computer is not my own.

All employees' timetables had special instructions for moving pivoting machinery, mainly concerned with weight limitations (mostly on branch lines), and the maximum speeds at which the machine could be moved. The speed with the boom trailing was usually five or ten miles faster then with it leading.

The old steam ditchers and their crawler crane successors were usually chained down to their carrier cars for long-distance moves. New cranes being delivered from the factories often had the boom separated from the crane and tied down on the same or a separate car.

The real problems were the wreckers, with their heavy, cast=steel booms. Movement at excessive speed, especially over rough track, would cause the boom to oscillate, or bounce, depending on the track irregularity. these oscillations could easily get out of control and the wrecker would end up on its side. Many an old wrecker bore the scars from such accidents.

One way to reduce this tendency was to provide a rest on the accompanying idler car, so that the boom was somewhat restricted from free movement. The Canadian Pacific, and its American subsidiary, the Soo Line, had a rather elaborate rest consisting of two four-wheeled dollies, the lower one moving laterally across the car, while the upper one moved lengthwise on top of the lowr one.

Some wreckers had a locking device on the rear end of the cab, consisting of two heavy rods, one at each corner,, that could be slid down into holes in the car body to prevent lateral swings;

John C. La Rue, Jr.
Bonita Springs ?, FL


-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Landgraf mark_landgraf@... [STMFC]
To: thecitrusbelt@... [STMFC] ; STMFC
Sent: Tue, Sep 12, 2017 9:37 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Pivoted Machinery

 
A pivoted machinery is usually considered to a rail mounted crane, or a pile driver, etc. The operating rules almost always call for the booms to be secured in the trailing position, so as to avoid creating a catapult situation while going down the track. 

Theoretically this could also apply to ‎equipment loaded on rr cars.  Think stuff like tracked excavators, either revenue or M of W. 

Mark Landgraf
Albany NY

From: thecitrusbelt@... [STMFC]
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2017 9:18 PM
Reply To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Pivoted Machinery

 
Pivoted Machinery
 
This looks like a placard:
 
 
But what best describes "pivoted machinery"?
 
Thanks.
 
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA

.


Denny Anspach <danspachmd@...>
 

John La Rue commented: 

Some wreckers had a locking device on the rear end of the cab, consisting of two heavy rods, one at each corner,, that could be slid down into holes in the car body to prevent lateral swings;

John’s discussion of issues moving these heavy cranes is one of the best yet. Thank you!  

 I have seen these cab tie-downs and understand the rationale; but then how does the boom and the auxiliary car supporting the boom  itself negotiate track curvature?  Would  these rods be spring-loaded?

Wreck booms that I have seen have been tethered at the ends with lateral cables to the auxiliary car such that the boom and cab swivel  when negotiating curvature.  

Denny


Denny S. Anspach MD
Okoboji, IA


Dennis Storzek
 




---In STMFC@..., <danspachmd@...> wrote :

John La Rue commented: 

Some wreckers had a locking device on the rear end of the cab, consisting of two heavy rods, one at each corner,, that could be slid down into holes in the car body to prevent lateral swings;

John’s discussion of issues moving these heavy cranes is one of the best yet. Thank you!  

 I have seen these cab tie-downs and understand the rationale; but then how does the boom and the auxiliary car supporting the boom  itself negotiate track curvature?  Would  these rods be spring-loaded?

Denny S. Anspach MD
====================

If you are talking auxiliary cars with a boom support like the Soo Line used, the boom rested on a little dolly that was free to roll several inches off center, which was enough for normal track curvature. Otherwise, the auxilary car gust provided a spacer, idler car, free to swing under the boom but not connected to it.

The problem with tying the boom to the idler is then the cab has to swing, and the cab is already as wide as the clearance diagram, so the counterweight end of the cab will swing outside of clearance. The boom, while longer, is much narrower.

Dennis Storzek


Dennis Storzek
 

Here is a link to a photo of a Soo wrecker that shows the boom support:


Note the idler car is free to move relative to the boom, while still supporting the weight.

Here is why you don't want the cab to swing relative to the frame. The boom isn't the only thing that overhangs the frame:


Dennis




Bruce Smith
 

Denny,

On the PRR Derricks (wreckers) were locked down in back with pins and then had rods to the boom.  However, the boom tie-downs went to the front of the wrecker chassis and not the idler.  The boom was free to swing over the idler as it had no contact.  http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/prr/prr490780o03.jpg

This was also the case with crawler cranes on flat cars, and in fact those carrier cars had dedicated steel tie down spots installed at each end.  John has a great PRR crawler photo on the web at:

However, I think we have diverged from the original post.  While this MOW study is definitely “pivoted machinery” there was much pivoted machinery shipped on the railroads that was not MOW.  While the obvious have been named, one that I noted has not yet would be military vehicles with turrets.  Indeed there is some information that early in WWII, errant turrets led to the installation of turret locks and then to the more visible barrel locks.  

IIRC, on the PRR the speed restrictions were specifically for derricks and not for pivoted machinery in general.  I am not aware of any speed restrictions on pivoted machinery as freight so long as it was secured in accordance with the AAR guides and was accepted by the railroad.

Regards

Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

https://www5.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."



On Sep 22, 2017, at 7:25 AM, Denny Anspach danspachmd@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:



John La Rue commented: 

Some wreckers had a locking device on the rear end of the cab, consisting of two heavy rods, one at each corner,, that could be slid down into holes in the car body to prevent lateral swings;

John’s discussion of issues moving these heavy cranes is one of the best yet. Thank you!  

 I have seen these cab tie-downs and understand the rationale; but then how does the boom and the auxiliary car supporting the boom  itself negotiate track curvature?  Would  these rods be spring-loaded?

Wreck booms that I have seen have been tethered at the ends with lateral cables to the auxiliary car such that the boom and cab swivel  when negotiating curvature.  

Denny


Denny S. Anspach MD
Okoboji, IA





Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
 

On 9/22/2017 7:53 AM, destorzek@... [STMFC] wrote:

Here is why you don't want the cab to swing relative to the frame.

    Note that the first photo (N N crane)  is not really the prototype as the trucks are attached to the car.  Like a 2-56 screw has them connected to the car:-D!

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
SPROG User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Jack Mullen
 

Here's another Soo wrecker, without the rolling boom support.  Boom is secured to the front of the wrecker chassis, as has been mentioned. The hooks have been lowered so they partly rest on the idler deck, and don't swing. The weight of the block keeps the cables taut, but there's enough play to allow for relative movement between the boom and idler car.  http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4574557

Here's a CNW wrecker, clearly showing the tie rods to the boom. You can just glimpse the tie rods at the back of the cab.  http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1125171

Another CHW wrecker, showing off the tie rods at the back of the cab, and the boom ties running diagonallly to tthe front corners of the chassis.  http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1728677

Jack Mullen