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Name that gondola end?

MDelvec952
 



Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.

                       ....Mike 
John Barry
 

Mike,

Most likely a Monon gon, but it could be a SOO line as they had some too.  The cars can be modeled with the Intermountain USRA gon and a Shapeways end.  We had a good discussion on a number of these in the Barriger collection several months back.
 
John Barry
 
ATSF North Bay Lines 
Golden Gates & Fast Freights 
Lovettsville, VA

707-490-9696 

PO Box 44736 
Washington, DC 20026-4736


From: MDelvec952 via Groups.Io <MDelvec952@...>
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Sent: Friday, May 18, 2018 10:26 PM
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?



Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.

                       ....Mike 
Tim O'Connor
 


Call it a "spiral" end. It's been discussed before, a little bit. As John Barry
says, Soo Line had some - series 63801 to 64799, 498 even-numbered cars in 1940.
By 1950 there were still 493 cars. By 1955, 224 cars had been rebuilt with steel
floors, but there were still 257 cars as built. In 1959 only 8 original cars were
on the roster, but there were still 469 cars with steel floors! And I know it's
going past 1960, but in 1965 there were still 277 of these strange gondolas!

Kinda makes me wonder, why aren't these considered to be "signature" Soo Line cars?

Tim O'Connor



===========================

Most likely a Monon gon, but it could be a SOO line as they had some too.  The cars can be modeled with the Intermountain USRA gon and a Shapeways end.  We had a good discussion on a number of these in the Barriger collection several months back.
John Barry

===========================

Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.
....Mike

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Thanks for sharing the photo, Tim.  I have a pair of Shapeways ends that were looking for a place to be used.  I assume that you meant ODD numbers!
 
Steve Hile


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Friday, May 18, 2018 11:36 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?


Call it a "spiral" end. It's been discussed before, a little bit. As John Barry
says, Soo Line had some - series 63801 to 64799, 498 even-numbered cars in 1940.
By 1950 there were still 493 cars. By 1955, 224 cars had been rebuilt with steel
floors, but there were still 257 cars as built. In 1959 only 8 original cars were
on the roster, but there were still 469 cars with steel floors! And I know it's
going past 1960, but in 1965 there were still 277 of these strange gondolas!

Kinda makes me wonder, why aren't these considered to be "signature" Soo Line cars?

Tim O'Connor



===========================

Most likely a Monon gon, but it could be a SOO line as they had some too.  The cars can be modeled with the Intermountain USRA gon and a Shapeways end.  We had a good discussion on a number of these in the Barriger collection several months back.
John Barry

===========================

Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.
....Mike

Bob Chapman
 

Mike --


Here's a model of the Monon gon. Chad Boas supplied the cast resin Spiral-Dreadnaught ends.


Regards,

Bob Chapman



Mike writes:

Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.
Ralph W. Brown
 

Hi Bob,
 
Nice job.  Are those the Shapeways ends that Steve mentioned, or something else?
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532
 

From: Bob Chapman
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 1:33 PM
To: main@realSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?
 

Mike --

 

Here's a model of the Monon gon. Chad Boas supplied the cast resin Spiral-Dreadnaught ends.

 

Regards,

Bob Chapman

 

 

Mike writes:

Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.
MDelvec952
 



Beautiful model, Bob, thanks.  I must have missed the discussion on these ends, but glad to see the photo of the model. 

The freight yard is in Newark, NJ, on the Lackawanna early in 1926, accessed through the lower level of a double-deck drawbridge. The picture was taken due to an incident on the upper level of the bridge, so there aren't any other photos off the yard taken this day.  The upper level is still in daily service today on NJTransit.

                      ....Mike


-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Chapman <chapbob611@...>
To: main <main@realSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Sat, May 19, 2018 1:34 pm
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?

Mike --

Here's a model of the Monon gon. Chad Boas supplied the cast resin Spiral-Dreadnaught ends.

Regards,
Bob Chapman


Mike writes:
Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.
Tim O'Connor
 


lol - yeah, odd, even, whatever. :-)

So it appears the cars were completely rebuilt after 1955! They received steel sides,
and probably new ends as well. This July 1959 photo (posted by Ted Culotta on Ebay)
shows the rebuilt cars. It would be very interesting to know whether any of them kept
their spiral ends.

Tim



Thanks for sharing the photo, Tim.  I have a pair of Shapeways ends that were looking for a place to be used.  I assume that you meant ODD numbers!
 
Steve Hile

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [ mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Friday, May 18, 2018 11:36 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?


Call it a "spiral" end. It's been discussed before, a little bit. As John Barry
says, Soo Line had some - series 63801 to 64799, 498 even-numbered cars in 1940.
By 1950 there were still 493 cars. By 1955, 224 cars had been rebuilt with steel
floors, but there were still 257 cars as built. In 1959 only 8 original cars were
on the roster, but there were still 469 cars with steel floors! And I know it's
going past 1960, but in 1965 there were still 277 of these strange gondolas!

Kinda makes me wonder, why aren't these considered to be "signature" Soo Line cars?

Tim O'Connor



===========================

Most likely a Monon gon, but it could be a SOO line as they had some too.  The cars can be modeled with the Intermountain USRA gon and a Shapeways end.  We had a good discussion on a number of these in the Barriger collection several months back.
John Barry

===========================

Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.
....Mike

Ralph W. Brown
 

Hi Mike,
 
Thanks for the background info.  There is a lot of interesting stuff in that photo besides the gon, including a horse-drawn wagon.  I would have thought they’d be gone from urban scenes by the mid-1920s.
 
Where did you find this beauty?
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532
 

From: MDelvec952 via Groups.Io
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 1:45 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?
 
 
 
Beautiful model, Bob, thanks.  I must have missed the discussion on these ends, but glad to see the photo of the model. 
 
The freight yard is in Newark, NJ, on the Lackawanna early in 1926, accessed through the lower level of a double-deck drawbridge. The picture was taken due to an incident on the upper level of the bridge, so there aren't any other photos off the yard taken this day.  The upper level is still in daily service today on NJTransit.
 
                      ....Mike


-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Chapman <chapbob611@...>
To: main <main@realSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Sat, May 19, 2018 1:34 pm
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?

Mike --
 
Here's a model of the Monon gon. Chad Boas supplied the cast resin Spiral-Dreadnaught ends.
 
Regards,
Bob Chapman
 
 
Mike writes:
Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.
 

Bruce Smith
 

Ralph,


Horse-power lasted well past WWII in some urban environments.  Referring to Producers Milk Co. in the city of Brooklyn, NY, "In 1952 there still were 20 horses on 18 daily milk wagon runs in addition to the fleet of retail trucks."

http://oldbrooklynhistory.org/gallery/


Regards

Bruce

Bruce Smith

O'Hare airport, headed home!


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Ralph W. Brown <rbrown51@...>
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 2:42 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?
 
Hi Mike,
 
Thanks for the background info.  There is a lot of interesting stuff in that photo besides the gon, including a horse-drawn wagon.  I would have thought they’d be gone from urban scenes by the mid-1920s.
 
Where did you find this beauty?
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532
 
From: MDelvec952 via Groups.Io
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 1:45 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?
 
 
 
Beautiful model, Bob, thanks.  I must have missed the discussion on these ends, but glad to see the photo of the model. 
 
The freight yard is in Newark, NJ, on the Lackawanna early in 1926, accessed through the lower level of a double-deck drawbridge. The picture was taken due to an incident on the upper level of the bridge, so there aren't any other photos off the yard taken this day.  The upper level is still in daily service today on NJTransit.
 
                      ....Mike


-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Chapman <chapbob611@...>
To: main <main@realSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Sat, May 19, 2018 1:34 pm
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?

Mike --
 
Here's a model of the Monon gon. Chad Boas supplied the cast resin Spiral-Dreadnaught ends.
 
Regards,
Bob Chapman
 
 
Mike writes:
Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.
 
Ralph W. Brown
 

Hi Bruce,
 
I had no idea, and I lived in Brooklyn until the Summer of 1948,  I remember streetcars, but not horse-drawn anything.  I guess we didn’t frequent the right parts of Brooklyn.
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532
 

From: Bruce Smith
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 3:52 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?
 

Ralph,

 

Horse-power lasted well past WWII in some urban environments.  Referring to Producers Milk Co. in the city of Brooklyn, NY, "In 1952 there still were 20 horses on 18 daily milk wagon runs in addition to the fleet of retail trucks."

http://oldbrooklynhistory.org/gallery/

 

Regards

Bruce

Bruce Smith

O'Hare airport, headed home!

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Ralph W. Brown <rbrown51@...>
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 2:42 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?
 
Hi Mike,
 
Thanks for the background info.  There is a lot of interesting stuff in that photo besides the gon, including a horse-drawn wagon.  I would have thought they’d be gone from urban scenes by the mid-1920s.
 
Where did you find this beauty?
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532
 
From: MDelvec952 via Groups.Io
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 1:45 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?
 
 
 
Beautiful model, Bob, thanks.  I must have missed the discussion on these ends, but glad to see the photo of the model. 
 
The freight yard is in Newark, NJ, on the Lackawanna early in 1926, accessed through the lower level of a double-deck drawbridge. The picture was taken due to an incident on the upper level of the bridge, so there aren't any other photos off the yard taken this day.  The upper level is still in daily service today on NJTransit.
 
                      ....Mike


-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Chapman <chapbob611@...>
To: main <main@realSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Sat, May 19, 2018 1:34 pm
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?

Mike --
 
Here's a model of the Monon gon. Chad Boas supplied the cast resin Spiral-Dreadnaught ends.
 
Regards,
Bob Chapman
 
 
Mike writes:
Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.
 
Bob Chapman
 

Ralph Brown writes:

Are those the Shapeways ends that Steve mentioned, or something else?


Ralph --

I bought the ends several years ago (7-8?) from Monon modeler Chad Boas, at the time a regular at the Naperville RPM meet. I'm guessing that Chad made them from a master; 3-D printing was still very much a novelty, given the timing. That said, I have no real knowledge whether there's a connection to the Shapeway product, or not. 


Regards,

Bob Chapman    
Schuyler Larrabee
 

Great shot for weathering a string of gon, Tim!

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2018 2:34 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?

 


lol - yeah, odd, even, whatever. :-)

So it appears the cars were completely rebuilt after 1955! They received steel sides,
and probably new ends as well. This July 1959 photo (posted by Ted Culotta on Ebay)
shows the rebuilt cars. It would be very interesting to know whether any of them kept
their spiral ends.

Tim




Thanks for sharing the photo, Tim.  I have a pair of Shapeways ends that were looking for a place to be used.  I assume that you meant ODD numbers!
 
Steve Hile

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [ mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Friday, May 18, 2018 11:36 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Name that gondola end?


Call it a "spiral" end. It's been discussed before, a little bit. As John Barry
says, Soo Line had some - series 63801 to 64799, 498 even-numbered cars in 1940.
By 1950 there were still 493 cars. By 1955, 224 cars had been rebuilt with steel
floors, but there were still 257 cars as built. In 1959 only 8 original cars were
on the roster, but there were still 469 cars with steel floors! And I know it's
going past 1960, but in 1965 there were still 277 of these strange gondolas!

Kinda makes me wonder, why aren't these considered to be "signature" Soo Line cars?

Tim O'Connor



===========================


Most likely a Monon gon, but it could be a SOO line as they had some too.  The cars can be modeled with the Intermountain USRA gon and a Shapeways end.  We had a good discussion on a number of these in the Barriger collection several months back.
John Barry


===========================


Came across a photo of a freight yard, and one one of the tracks is the end of a gondola I hadn't seen before. I'm sharing it here so that others may see it, and so that some may be able to identify it, with one continuous indentation filling the end, like lines on a vinyl record.
....Mike

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