Topics

Poultry Cars

Nelson Moyer
 

I just read Kristin Dummler’s presentation on live poultry shipping, a clinic I couldn’t fit into my schedule in Lisle. It was quite informative and the photos were outstanding. Kristin mentioned that the jury was still out on a suitable mesh for modeling these cars, and since I couldn’t find an email address to go direct, I’m posting the information here for all to see. I built a 1914 CB&Q horse car which required window screens. Searching the web, I found a link for a company that sells stainless steel screen in many mesh sizes, and I used their 400 mesh screen for my horse car. The URL is:

 

www.twpinc.com

 

They will send samples if you’re not sure which size best fits your needs. I’m sure that Kristin will be able to find the perfect screen for her poultry cars on this site. Because they have a minimum order size, I went in with several other modelers on a group order to share the cost. Contact me directly if you want more information on this product.

 

Nelson Moyer

Jake Schaible
 

Nelson,

Where did you she her presentation?  I'm one of those whom work kept me from attending.  

The screen I measured on the existent poultry car in StL, IIRC, is a rather simple welded wire diamond mesh pattern of ~ 1.1" x 1.1" square.  

Cheers,

Jake

Kristin Dummler
 

Nelson,

Thank you for the source. I will definitely give them a look. The hard part is getting something with openings small enough to be to scale.

Kristin Dummler


On 10/26/2018 3:48 PM, Nelson Moyer wrote:

I just read Kristin Dummler’s presentation on live poultry shipping, a clinic I couldn’t fit into my schedule in Lisle. It was quite informative and the photos were outstanding. Kristin mentioned that the jury was still out on a suitable mesh for modeling these cars, and since I couldn’t find an email address to go direct, I’m posting the information here for all to see. I built a 1914 CB&Q horse car which required window screens. Searching the web, I found a link for a company that sells stainless steel screen in many mesh sizes, and I used their 400 mesh screen for my horse car. The URL is:

 

www.twpinc.com

 

They will send samples if you’re not sure which size best fits your needs. I’m sure that Kristin will be able to find the perfect screen for her poultry cars on this site. Because they have a minimum order size, I went in with several other modelers on a group order to share the cost. Contact me directly if you want more information on this product.

 

Nelson Moyer


Kristin Dummler
 

Jake,

You can actually get to the complete presentation and handout here:

http://trainmodeler.com/clinic-handouts/

Your measurement memory is pretty good. The screen is actually 1/8" wire in a 1.5" x 1.5" diamond pattern. I was lucky enough to get a volunteer at the museum to get in and get actual measurements off the car.

Kristin D.


On 10/26/2018 6:26 PM, Jake Schaible wrote:

Nelson,

Where did you she her presentation?  I'm one of those whom work kept me from attending.  

The screen I measured on the existent poultry car in StL, IIRC, is a rather simple welded wire diamond mesh pattern of ~ 1.1" x 1.1" square.  

Cheers,

Jake


Nelson Moyer
 

I downloaded her PowerPoint presentation from the Chicagoland RPM web site. Given that you know the screen size, it should be easy to figure out which mesh size matches.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jake Schaible
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 6:26 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars

 

Nelson,

Where did you she her presentation?  I'm one of those whom work kept me from attending.  

The screen I measured on the existent poultry car in StL, IIRC, is a rather simple welded wire diamond mesh pattern of ~ 1.1" x 1.1" square.  

Cheers,

Jake

Nelson Moyer
 

Kristin,

 

I can guarantee that you will be able to find scale mesh on that web site. My 400 mesh was perfect for my horse cars. You could see objects thought it when it was backlighted. I don’t remember the HO scale size of the mesh, but if you get too small of a mesh, it becomes opaque. The web site give the actual dimensions, so you can do the scale conversion and choose the right mesh.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kristin Dummler
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 6:49 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars

 

Nelson,

Thank you for the source. I will definitely give them a look. The hard part is getting something with openings small enough to be to scale.

Kristin Dummler

 

On 10/26/2018 3:48 PM, Nelson Moyer wrote:

I just read Kristin Dummler’s presentation on live poultry shipping, a clinic I couldn’t fit into my schedule in Lisle. It was quite informative and the photos were outstanding. Kristin mentioned that the jury was still out on a suitable mesh for modeling these cars, and since I couldn’t find an email address to go direct, I’m posting the information here for all to see. I built a 1914 CB&Q horse car which required window screens. Searching the web, I found a link for a company that sells stainless steel screen in many mesh sizes, and I used their 400 mesh screen for my horse car. The URL is:

 

www.twpinc.com

 

They will send samples if you’re not sure which size best fits your needs. I’m sure that Kristin will be able to find the perfect screen for her poultry cars on this site. Because they have a minimum order size, I went in with several other modelers on a group order to share the cost. Contact me directly if you want more information on this product.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

Douglas Harding
 

In her presentation, Kristen said the mesh on the car at St Louis measured:

1/8” woven wire, 1.5”x1.5” vertical diamond pattern

In HO that calls for a  0.0172 x 0.0172 mesh

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jake Schaible
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 6:26 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars

 

Nelson,

Where did you she her presentation?  I'm one of those whom work kept me from attending.  

The screen I measured on the existent poultry car in StL, IIRC, is a rather simple welded wire diamond mesh pattern of ~ 1.1" x 1.1" square.  

Cheers,

Jake

Nelson Moyer
 

400 mesh specs are 400x400 per in., opening size 0.0013 in. sq., 0.0010 in. wire diameter. This mesh was used for window screed, so it’s smaller than chicken wire. Anyone interested in chicken wire should have no trouble finding a suitable mesh on the TWP web page, just look at the spec. chart and match 0.0172 in. sq. Turn the wire 45° for a diamond pattern.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Douglas Harding
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 9:39 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars

 

In her presentation, Kristen said the mesh on the car at St Louis measured:

1/8” woven wire, 1.5”x1.5” vertical diamond pattern

In HO that calls for a  0.0172 x 0.0172 mesh

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jake Schaible
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 6:26 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars

 

Nelson,

Where did you she her presentation?  I'm one of those whom work kept me from attending.  

The screen I measured on the existent poultry car in StL, IIRC, is a rather simple welded wire diamond mesh pattern of ~ 1.1" x 1.1" square.  

Cheers,

Jake

Dave Parker
 

Nelson:

To get 1.5 x 1.5" openings in HO scale, one could consider ~40 mesh screen with ~0.017" openings.

The problem with metal screens for Kristin's application is the wire size -- 1/8" wire in HO scale would be 0.0014", which is much finer than the wire in any of the commercial metal screens, brass or stainless.   "Traditional" chicken wire would be even more problematic given how fine the wire is there.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA

Ralph W. Brown
 

Doug, Dave, et al.,
 
Doug said - “In her presentation, Kristen said the mesh on the car at St Louis measured: 1/8” woven wire, 1.5”x1.5” vertical diamond pattern.”
 
Diamond patterns are typically described by their axis dimensions, so doing the math the mesh would be 1.06066” square and rotated 45 degrees. Eighth inch wire would be 0.001435” diameter, and the mesh would be 0.01248” x 0.01248”.  That would be, I think, about 82 mesh of 0.0014 wire.  As it turns out, there is actually a stainless steel mesh that comes reasonably close!  It is T316 stainless “high transparency” 0.0012” wire 80 mesh, but it’s more than a bit pricey starting at $19.50/sq. ft. for 1-24 sq. ft. with a minimum order of $100.00.  A full 4’ x 100’ roll goes for $1,950.00, which drops the price per sq. ft. to $4.88. 
 
 
It looks like pretty amazing stuff, but given the very small quantities most of might need, I think suspect we.d need a fair sized group to make a purchase worthwhile.  A 3” x 3” sample or “swatch” is also available for $10.00 ($40.00/sq. ft.).
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com
 

From: Dave Parker via Groups.Io
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 11:26 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 
Nelson:

To get 1.5 x 1.5" openings in HO scale, one could consider ~40 mesh screen with ~0.017" openings.

The problem with metal screens for Kristin's application is the wire size -- 1/8" wire in HO scale would be 0.0014", which is much finer than the wire in any of the commercial metal screens, brass or stainless.   "Traditional" chicken wire would be even more problematic given how fine the wire is there.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA

Douglas Harding
 

One thing missing from Kristen’s presentation handout were the brief videos. They are not part of her pdf. I posted links to the videos she used, to this list back in August.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ralph W. Brown
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 11:20 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars

 

Doug, Dave, et al.,

 

Doug said - “In her presentation, Kristen said the mesh on the car at St Louis measured: 1/8” woven wire, 1.5”x1.5” vertical diamond pattern.”

 

Diamond patterns are typically described by their axis dimensions, so doing the math the mesh would be 1.06066” square and rotated 45 degrees. Eighth inch wire would be 0.001435” diameter, and the mesh would be 0.01248” x 0.01248”.  That would be, I think, about 82 mesh of 0.0014 wire.  As it turns out, there is actually a stainless steel mesh that comes reasonably close!  It is T316 stainless “high transparency” 0.0012” wire 80 mesh, but it’s more than a bit pricey starting at $19.50/sq. ft. for 1-24 sq. ft. with a minimum order of $100.00.  A full 4’ x 100’ roll goes for $1,950.00, which drops the price per sq. ft. to $4.88. 

 

 

It looks like pretty amazing stuff, but given the very small quantities most of might need, I think suspect we.d need a fair sized group to make a purchase worthwhile.  A 3” x 3” sample or “swatch” is also available for $10.00 ($40.00/sq. ft.).

 

Pax,

 

 

Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com

 

From: Dave Parker via Groups.Io

Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 11:26 PM

To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io

Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars

 

Nelson:

To get 1.5 x 1.5" openings in HO scale, one could consider ~40 mesh screen with ~0.017" openings.

The problem with metal screens for Kristin's application is the wire size -- 1/8" wire in HO scale would be 0.0014", which is much finer than the wire in any of the commercial metal screens, brass or stainless.   "Traditional" chicken wire would be even more problematic given how fine the wire is there.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA

Kristin Dummler
 

All,
Thank you all for your input on the mesh! The screen on TWP is really quite impressive and close to prototypical dimension. I did have a chance to look around there a bit yesterday evening.

I'd have to get a sample and see what it looked like in person to know if it works for the poultry, however I'll most likely give it a try. So far, all the other sample materials I have are not quite right.

For those who haven't seen the presentation, here are the complete measurements I was given for the car in St. Louis:
A)The screen wire is a 1/8" diameter solid wire woven
B) The pattern is in a 1 1/2" x 1 1/2"Diamond Pattern vertically
C) The "C" channel frame holding the wire screen is a 1" tall, with 1/2" legs
D) The length of the screens, (along the car) is 14'-6"
E) The screens are 11" tall
F) The gap between the screens is 3"
G) That is tongue and groove wood sticking out between the screens.

The videos that Doug mentions are really fantastic. Unfortunately PDF does not have live video capability yet.

Kristin Dummler



On 10/26/2018 11:38 PM, Douglas Harding wrote:

One thing missing from Kristen’s presentation handout were the brief videos. They are not part of her pdf. I posted links to the videos she used, to this list back in August.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ralph W. Brown
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 11:20 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars

 

Doug, Dave, et al.,

 

Doug said - “In her presentation, Kristen said the mesh on the car at St Louis measured: 1/8” woven wire, 1.5”x1.5” vertical diamond pattern.”

 

Diamond patterns are typically described by their axis dimensions, so doing the math the mesh would be 1.06066” square and rotated 45 degrees. Eighth inch wire would be 0.001435” diameter, and the mesh would be 0.01248” x 0.01248”.  That would be, I think, about 82 mesh of 0.0014 wire.  As it turns out, there is actually a stainless steel mesh that comes reasonably close!  It is T316 stainless “high transparency” 0.0012” wire 80 mesh, but it’s more than a bit pricey starting at $19.50/sq. ft. for 1-24 sq. ft. with a minimum order of $100.00.  A full 4’ x 100’ roll goes for $1,950.00, which drops the price per sq. ft. to $4.88. 

 

 

It looks like pretty amazing stuff, but given the very small quantities most of might need, I think suspect we.d need a fair sized group to make a purchase worthwhile.  A 3” x 3” sample or “swatch” is also available for $10.00 ($40.00/sq. ft.).

 

Pax,

 

 

Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com

 

From: Dave Parker via Groups.Io

Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 11:26 PM

Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars

 

Nelson:

To get 1.5 x 1.5" openings in HO scale, one could consider ~40 mesh screen with ~0.017" openings.

The problem with metal screens for Kristin's application is the wire size -- 1/8" wire in HO scale would be 0.0014", which is much finer than the wire in any of the commercial metal screens, brass or stainless.   "Traditional" chicken wire would be even more problematic given how fine the wire is there.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA


Daniel A. Mitchell
 

The problem besetting most of us regarding the wire mesh on the poultry cars is not the 1.5” mesh size but the 1/8” wire size. In HO scale that’s only a little over 0.001”. None of the available mesh, either woven or photo-etched, is nearly this small. Thus the fine mesh screens available are far too dense, and usually barely transparent at all. Photos of the poultry cars show the screens as very transparent, and the chickens (or whatever) inside as very visible.

The issue here is really the mesh OPENING size, not the wire size. To get an adequate opening, and accompanying appropriate transparency, a larger than scale wire size is a necessity.

And, if woven, the larger-than-scale wire size results in a mesh far thicker than scale. Was the original mesh woven or welded?

Even if a scale wire-sized screen was available it would be spider-web delicate and pretty much unusable. Thus, due to the larger-than-scale wire sizes involved any screens available in HO have to be far coarser pitch than scale or you could not see through them.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Oct 26, 2018, at 7:52 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

I downloaded her PowerPoint presentation from the Chicagoland RPM web site. Given that you know the screen size, it should be easy to figure out which mesh size matches.
 
Nelson Moyer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jake Schaible
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 6:26 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 

Nelson,

Where did you she her presentation?  I'm one of those whom work kept me from attending.  

The screen I measured on the existent poultry car in StL, IIRC, is a rather simple welded wire diamond mesh pattern of ~ 1.1" x 1.1" square.  

Cheers,

Jake


Daniel A. Mitchell
 

One only needs about 10% hole-to-matrix size to see through something when backlighted.

The poultry cars, however are very transparent when FRONT lighted. This requires more like 90% hole-to-matrix proportion. I’ve never seen really small mesh of any kind that comes even close to this proportion.

Thus, to my knowledge, all the really fine mesh available is far to opaque to represent the mesh on the poultry cars.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Oct 26, 2018, at 7:57 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

Kristin,
 
I can guarantee that you will be able to find scale mesh on that web site. My 400 mesh was perfect for my horse cars. You could see objects thought it when it was backlighted. I don’t remember the HO scale size of the mesh, but if you get too small of a mesh, it becomes opaque. The web site give the actual dimensions, so you can do the scale conversion and choose the right mesh.
 
Nelson Moyer
 
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kristin Dummler
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 6:49 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 

Nelson,

Thank you for the source. I will definitely give them a look. The hard part is getting something with openings small enough to be to scale.

Kristin Dummler

 
On 10/26/2018 3:48 PM, Nelson Moyer wrote:
I just read Kristin Dummler’s presentation on live poultry shipping, a clinic I couldn’t fit into my schedule in Lisle. It was quite informative and the photos were outstanding. Kristin mentioned that the jury was still out on a suitable mesh for modeling these cars, and since I couldn’t find an email address to go direct, I’m posting the information here for all to see. I built a 1914 CB&Q horse car which required window screens. Searching the web, I found a link for a company that sells stainless steel screen in many mesh sizes, and I used their 400 mesh screen for my horse car. The URL is:
 
 
They will send samples if you’re not sure which size best fits your needs. I’m sure that Kristin will be able to find the perfect screen for her poultry cars on this site. Because they have a minimum order size, I went in with several other modelers on a group order to share the cost. Contact me directly if you want more information on this product.
 
Nelson Moyer
 


Daniel A. Mitchell
 

And even more important, wire size of only a bit over 0.001” diameter (1/8” = 0.125”, and 0.125 /87= 0.0014”). Not at all practical.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Oct 26, 2018, at 10:38 PM, Douglas Harding <doug.harding@...> wrote:

In her presentation, Kristen said the mesh on the car at St Louis measured: 
1/8” woven wire, 1.5”x1.5” vertical diamond pattern
In HO that calls for a  0.0172 x 0.0172 mesh
 
Doug  Harding
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jake Schaible
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 6:26 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 

Nelson,

Where did you she her presentation?  I'm one of those whom work kept me from attending.  

The screen I measured on the existent poultry car in StL, IIRC, is a rather simple welded wire diamond mesh pattern of ~ 1.1" x 1.1" square.  

Cheers,

Jake


Bill Welch
 

Knowing Kristin and her background and who she linked up w/at Lisle, the two of them will "get 'er done."

Bill Welch

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Indeed! The dimensions are close to those required, to my surprise.

Still, the mesh shown is far to opaque to represent the mesh on the poultry cars. In my profession I had opportunity to work with a variety of such SS mesh in scientific sieves, filters, and such. I never saw any that was much better than 50% transparent, regardless of mesh size. Some of this problem may be due to the shiny surface of the SS mesh reflecting light. With sizes much below 0.020” things begin to look very different as light reacts differently to small objects than it does to large objects. Diffraction softens the appearance of all edges making small things look larger than they actually are. Thus a part of the problem here is physics. It’s similar to the problem of flat vs. glossy surfaces … such things to NOT "scale” as we expect since the light we view them with cannot be "scaled”.

Thus one faces the question… “Do you want it to be “scale”, or look like it is “scale? … choose ONE!  You can’t have both.

Another issue is that none of the photos I’ve seen of the poultry cars show shiny stainless wire mesh … more likely it was galvanized, a dull gray color, or painted. A real problem would be painting the very fine wire mesh screen without further blocking the holes in the mesh and reducing transparency. Perhaps some kind of chemical metal-blackening would work?

In my opinion adequate transparency is the most important issue here. YMMV.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Oct 26, 2018, at 10:54 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

400 mesh specs are 400x400 per in., opening size 0.0013 in. sq., 0.0010 in. wire diameter. This mesh was used for window screed, so it’s smaller than chicken wire. Anyone interested in chicken wire should have no trouble finding a suitable mesh on the TWP web page, just look at the spec. chart and match 0.0172 in. sq. Turn the wire 45° for a diamond pattern.
 
Nelson Moyer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Douglas Harding
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 9:39 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 
In her presentation, Kristen said the mesh on the car at St Louis measured:
1/8” woven wire, 1.5”x1.5” vertical diamond pattern
In HO that calls for a  0.0172 x 0.0172 mesh
 
Doug  Harding
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jake Schaible
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 6:26 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 

Nelson,

Where did you she her presentation?  I'm one of those whom work kept me from attending.  

The screen I measured on the existent poultry car in StL, IIRC, is a rather simple welded wire diamond mesh pattern of ~ 1.1" x 1.1" square.  

Cheers,

Jake


Jared Harper
 

You need to find a cooperative spider who can spin its threads without the adhesive.

Jared Harper
Athens, GA

Douglas Harding
 

Dan have you looked at Kristen’s clinic pdf? It includes photos of the still existing car. The close up photos clearly show a woven wire mesh. I would suspect galvanized wire, as the cars shows considerable rust in places, but no rust on the woven wire.

 

The website posted by Nelson offers a mesh in the necessary wire size. And Ralph has pointed out a mesh opening is offered that comes close to that on a poultry car, for use in HO. Will it be shiny?Using stainless steel no doubt it will be. But do we have anything else that comes close?

 

I, for one, think this is an exciting development in the quest for a poultry car. Having been researching them for some time myself, I was excited to see Kristen’s presentation. And the ensuing discussion about a possible etched screen, and now the offering of a suitable wire mesh https://www.twpinc.com/wire-mesh-material/stainless-steel/80-mesh-stainless-high-transparency-0012 makes a credible model all the more possible.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

Nelson Moyer
 

Dan, have you visited the TWP, Inc. web page and looked at the sample photos of fine stainless steel mesh? The phots show a model’s hand holding a 3x3 swatch of each available mesh so that prospective buyers can see the transparency. The photos are front lighted, and the mesh specifications, including wire diameter and opening size, are given for each mesh. I believe you will find these photos instructive.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 8:50 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars

 

One only needs about 10% hole-to-matrix size to see through something when backlighted.

 

The poultry cars, however are very transparent when FRONT lighted. This requires more like 90% hole-to-matrix proportion. I’ve never seen really small mesh of any kind that comes even close to this proportion.

 

Thus, to my knowledge, all the really fine mesh available is far to opaque to represent the mesh on the poultry cars.

 

Dan Mitchell

==========