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Proctor & Gamble Tank Cars


Bob Chaparro
 

Proctor & Gamble Tank Cars

This photo is from the Louisiana Digital Library.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA



Bill Keene
 

Hi Bob,

I can not add much about the tank cars… others are more tank car literate than I am… but can offer some info about the ship…

The photo must have been taken sometime in the 1930s and it appears to be somewhere on the Mississippi River. More of a guessing game on this data. Wonder if the contents are being loaded or unloaded from the ship. Also what those contents might be. 

Can add the following about the ship…

5,824 grt tanker built by Kockums Mekaniska Verksted, Malmö, Sweden. Completed in 1929 as MAX ALBRECHT for Max Albrecht Kommanditgesellschaft, Hamburg. On 30 August 1939 she sailed from Houston, Texas and put into El Ferrol, Spain where she was interned. Surrendered in May 1945 to the British Ministry of War Transport (MoWT) and renamed EMPIRE TAGRALIA. Sold 1947 to Basra Steam Shipping Co Ltd, London and renamed REPTON. Sold in 1952 to Lloyd Siciliano di Armamento SpA, Palermo, Italy and renamed ALCANTARA. Scrapped in September 1960 at Vado Ligure, Italy.


Description:
Builder:Kockums Mekaniska Verksted, Malmö, Sweden 
Year Of build: 1929 (Yard no 158) 
Owner: Dr. Max Albrecht Kommanditgesellschaft, Hamburg, Germany (Deutsches Reich) 
Measures: BRT 5824, LOA 122,53 m, breadth 16,76 m, draught 7,93 m, 11,5 kn 
History: 
MAX ALBRECHT (1929 - 1945) 
EMPIRE TAGRALIA (1945 - 1947) 
Owner: British Government, Operator Ministry of War Transport, London, U.K. 
REPTON (1947 - 1952) 
Owner: Basra Steam Shipping Co Ltd, London, U.K. 
ALCANTARA (1952 - 1960) 
Owner: Lloyd Siciliano di Armamento SpA, Palermo, Italy 
BU 1960 Lloyd Siciliano di Armamento SpA, Palermo, Italy 

An interesting scene for a seaport based layout. 

Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA

On Feb 21, 2019, at 2:39 PM, Bob Chaparro <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:

Proctor & Gamble Tank Cars
This photo is from the Louisiana Digital Library.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA

<P_G_Tank_Cars.jpg>


Dave Parker
 

The attached JPEG didn't have much resolution, so here is the link to the LDL:

http://louisianadigitallibrary.org/islandora/object/hnoc-clf%3A8480

I little more detail is evident here, but it's still not easy to identify very many of the cars.  They all look to date to the late teens or early twenties, and are consistent with the PGX listings in my 1930 and 1935 ORERs.  The PGX listing is gone by 1940, and Ian Cranstones's database (http://www.nakina.net/other/report/reportp.html ) suggests that the reporting mark was briefly used by GATC before being phased out altogether.

Bill's data on the boat indeed narrows the window to the 1930s (aka the decade that almost nobody models).

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA


Bruce Smith
 

S.W.A.G. - Molasses is the cargo.

The cars are a range of types, mostly AC&F, with a few high walkway cars (AC&F type 7 ?)

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Dave Parker via Groups.Io <spottab@...>
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2019 5:14 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Proctor & Gamble Tank Cars
 
The attached JPEG didn't have much resolution, so here is the link to the LDL:

http://louisianadigitallibrary.org/islandora/object/hnoc-clf%3A8480
louisianadigitallibrary.org
View of the steamship ""Max Albrecht"" docked at a wharf with railroad tank cars.



I little more detail is evident here, but it's still not easy to identify very many of the cars.  They all look to date to the late teens or early twenties, and are consistent with the PGX listings in my 1930 and 1935 ORERs.  The PGX listing is gone by 1940, and Ian Cranstones's database (http://www.nakina.net/other/report/reportp.html ) suggests that the reporting mark was briefly used by GATC before being phased out altogether.

Bill's data on the boat indeed narrows the window to the 1930s (aka the decade that almost nobody models).

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA


Spen Kellogg <spninetynine@...>
 

On 2/21/2019 3:59 PM, Bill Keene via Groups.Io wrote:
Hi Bob,

I can not add much about the tank cars… others are more tank car
literate than I am… but can offer some info about the ship…

The photo must have been taken sometime in the 1930s and it appears to
be somewhere on the Mississippi River. More of a guessing game on this
data. Wonder if the contents are being loaded or unloaded from the
ship. Also what those contents might be.
The cars were carrying some kind of vegetable oil, most likely palm oil,
although coconut oil is also possible. Some of those tank cars (the ones
with the high running boards) were probably built in the first decade of
the 20th century. I would guess that they were 8,000 gallon MCB Class II
cars built around 1908 by ACF Milton. Note the early number on the
nearest one.

Spen Kellogg


Tony Thompson
 

I agree with Spen Kellogg (who should know) that the cargoes here were vegetable oil from the Caribbean, likely palm oil. Remember that Proctor & Gamble made a lot of soap.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Peter Weiglin
 

Fellas, I almost hate to bringt his up, but -

In case someone is doing decal artwork or car cards, it should be noted that the name of the company is PROCTER and Gamble.
Company was founded in 1837 by William Procter and James Gamble.

Proctor is a town near Duluth, or someone who oversees exams

Peter Weiglin


Aley, Jeff A
 

Indeed, P&G made a lot of soap. As you know, soaps can be made with many different kinds of oil - coconut, palm, etc.
One of their products was a soap made with a mixture of PALM oil and OLIVE oil -- PALMOLIVE.

Attached is an aerial photo of the P&G factory in Kansas City, KS. You can see many tank cars were present (though none are identifiable from this altitude).

Regards,

-Jeff

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tony Thompson
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2019 6:27 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Proctor & Gamble Tank Cars

I agree with Spen Kellogg (who should know) that the cargoes here were vegetable oil from the Caribbean, likely palm oil. Remember that Proctor & Gamble made a lot of soap.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com Publishers of books on railroad history


mopacfirst
 

If this photo is New Orleans, then the ship is facing upriver since the docks were mostly along the city side.  The angle of the sun reinforces that thought.

That makes it more likely that this is an unloading scene.

Ron Merrick


Tim O'Connor
 

That's a great image Jeff I wish I could find a higher resolution view... there are lots of images
online but I can't find a better one of that facility. Here's another P&G building in St Louis.

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5267/5646992577_680913d9be_b.jpg

Tim O'

On 2/22/2019 1:15 PM, Aley, Jeff A wrote:
Indeed, P&G made a lot of soap. As you know, soaps can be made with many different kinds of oil - coconut, palm, etc.
One of their products was a soap made with a mixture of PALM oil and OLIVE oil -- PALMOLIVE.

Attached is an aerial photo of the P&G factory in Kansas City, KS. You can see many tank cars were present (though none are identifiable from this altitude).

Regards,

-Jeff

Armourdale04.jpg: https://RealSTMFC.groups.io/g/main/attachment/162355/0
--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*


G.J. Irwin
 

Actually, Palmolive Soap was a product of the Colgate-Palmolive Company, a key P&G rival.   One of the well-known C-P plants was walking distance from my boyhood home in Jersey City, New Jersey... served by classic street trackage south of the PRR's Exchange Place station.  I have a couple of photos of tank cars parked at the plant.

The best known soap made by P&G was Ivory.

We now return you to your regular programming, already in progress...

George Irwin


Ted Culotta
 

Ummmm.... Palmolive is made by Colgate-Palmolive. That’s akin to talking about the IPhone from Samsung.


Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Friends,

P&G also has a large plant near Sacramento which used to produce "synthetic granules", meaning powdered laundry detergent such as Tide. I had the chance to tour the factory in my boyhood (factory tours are largely a thing of the past!). The Sacramento facility produced or used a lot of glycerine, which I learned had a potential wartime role in making explosives. The facility was switched by the Central California Traction Co. and the SP. Today that would be the UP.

Getting off topic a bit, but the Los Angeles Soap Company had a plant which made a brand called White King D, the first granulated detergent. They sponsored "Queen for a Day" on radio and TV for years. The company went out of business in 1987. When I drove a truck in LA after college I used to go past the plant, and though I carried a camera I never took a photo.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 2/22/19 6:06 PM, G.J. Irwin wrote:
Actually, Palmolive Soap was a product of the Colgate-Palmolive Company, a key P&G rival.   One of the well-known C-P plants was walking distance from my boyhood home in Jersey City, New Jersey... served by classic street trackage south of the PRR's Exchange Place station.  I have a couple of photos of tank cars parked at the plant.

The best known soap made by P&G was Ivory.

We now return you to your regular programming, already in progress...

George Irwin


Dave Nelson
 

Palmolive was also in Berkeley CA. and right next door was Philadelphia Quartz (of California) who did own their own freight cars.  PQ production was simply piped next door to the soap factory.  I don’t know how common that was… it certainly saved on shipping costs so it makes a lot of sense given ordinary soap is likely a pretty competitive business. 

 

My point is anyone who comes across a Palmolive or P&G plant might find a PQ plant very close by… and vice versa.

 

Dave Nelson

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of G.J. Irwin
Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 3:06 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Proctor & Gamble Tank Cars

 

Actually, Palmolive Soap was a product of the Colgate-Palmolive Company, a key P&G rival.   One of the well-known C-P plants was walking distance from my boyhood home in Jersey City, New Jersey... served by classic street trackage south of the PRR's Exchange Place station.  I have a couple of photos of tank cars parked at the plant.

The best known soap made by P&G was Ivory.

We now return you to your regular programming, already in progress...

George Irwin