Topics

hi tech HO air hoses


Richard McQuade
 

I have posted this request with the Early Rails Grp already but thought I would ask this grp too. I'm interested in "investing" in Hi Tech HO freight car air hoses and would like to know what experiences people have had with them. I would be equipping about 80 pieces of rolling stock so this would be a significant expenditure in resources. They offer 22" and 26" lengths in HO. I presume the 22" is for earlier eras  Any info or insights about them would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Richard


Brian Carlson
 

They are my go-to for air hoses. They work in most places.  I use them in their bracket and the PSC bracket.  

Use the 22” ones. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On May 21, 2019, at 5:35 PM, Richard McQuade via Groups.Io <richardmcquade@...> wrote:

I have posted this request with the Early Rails Grp already but thought I would ask this grp too. I'm interested in "investing" in Hi Tech HO freight car air hoses and would like to know what experiences people have had with them. I would be equipping about 80 pieces of rolling stock so this would be a significant expenditure in resources. They offer 22" and 26" lengths in HO. I presume the 22" is for earlier eras  Any info or insights about them would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Richard


Nelson Moyer
 

I’ve used then since they were first introduced with the Precision Scale bracket. The PS brackets have dimple for starting the bit, but the castings aren’t always complete at the U-bolt, so I ‘ve lost a few by drilling through the side of the U-bolt. Start the hole with a #79 bit, then move up to a #77, then a #76. The air pipe on the air hose sometimes has a casting line with flash that interferes with threading it through the U-bold. I ‘ve cut off the flash with a double edge razor blade, which has a thinner blade and is sharper than a single edge razor blade. If the flash is minimal, I taper the end of the air pipe slightly to get it started while threading it into the U-bolt. I bought some YMW air hose brackets to try, but I haven’t used any yet. The detail is better on PS brackets, but the YMW brackets look like it would be easier to thread the air pipe since the hole is drilled before bending, and the metal isn’t as hard to drill.

 

Anybody want to buy a large supply of Kadee plastic air hoses cheap?

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Richard McQuade via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2019 4:35 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] hi tech HO air hoses

 

I have posted this request with the Early Rails Grp already but thought I would ask this grp too. I'm interested in "investing" in Hi Tech HO freight car air hoses and would like to know what experiences people have had with them. I would be equipping about 80 pieces of rolling stock so this would be a significant expenditure in resources. They offer 22" and 26" lengths in HO. I presume the 22" is for earlier eras  Any info or insights about them would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Richard


webotkin
 

Hi Richard,

 

I have been using Hi-Tech air hoses for several years and they are excellent.  On new cars, I use them when I am building the car.  For cars with plastic air hoses, I replace them as they break.  Obviously the advantage is that they don’t break and look as good as the cast plastic ones!  To attach them I use AC cement or canopy glue.  Both seem to work fine.  Also, I paint them before installing with Floquil rail brown which seems to stick to the rubber surface.  About the only downside is that you can’t form a curve in them like you can with plastic hoses.

 

William E. Botkin

Centennial, CO

 


Scott
 

I agree with the others.  I use the ones that come with the cast metal bracket because it looks nice.

Scott McDonald


Fran Giacoma
 

I installed the 22” hoses (a mix of with and without brackets) on 120 cars on my September 1956 era layout. Once installed, I paint them Tamiya German Grey XF-63, the closest color of a faded rubber hose in my eyes. I also replace the plastic ones with them when broken.
Fran Giacoma


Jack Burgess
 

Nelson has a good summary which seems to be the same as my experience. Keep in mind that the air hose needs to be installed tipped toward the coupler at a 30 degree angle, not straight down.

 

Jack Burgess

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Nelson Moyer
Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2019 3:27 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] hi tech HO air hoses

 

I’ve used then since they were first introduced with the Precision Scale bracket. The PS brackets have dimple for starting the bit, but the castings aren’t always complete at the U-bolt, so I ‘ve lost a few by drilling through the side of the U-bolt. Start the hole with a #79 bit, then move up to a #77, then a #76. The air pipe on the air hose sometimes has a casting line with flash that interferes with threading it through the U-bold. I ‘ve cut off the flash with a double edge razor blade, which has a thinner blade and is sharper than a single edge razor blade. If the flash is minimal, I taper the end of the air pipe slightly to get it started while threading it into the U-bolt. I bought some YMW air hose brackets to try, but I haven’t used any yet. The detail is better on PS brackets, but the YMW brackets look like it would be easier to thread the air pipe since the hole is drilled before bending, and the metal isn’t as hard to drill.

 

Anybody want to buy a large supply of Kadee plastic air hoses cheap?

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Richard McQuade via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2019 4:35 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] hi tech HO air hoses

 

I have posted this request with the Early Rails Grp already but thought I would ask this grp too. I'm interested in "investing" in Hi Tech HO freight car air hoses and would like to know what experiences people have had with them. I would be equipping about 80 pieces of rolling stock so this would be a significant expenditure in resources. They offer 22" and 26" lengths in HO. I presume the 22" is for earlier eras  Any info or insights about them would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Richard


Richard McQuade
 

Looks like more that a few satisfied customers here! Thanks for the quick responses and tips!
Richard


Tim O'Connor
 


Also Tamiya XF-85 rubber black




On 5/21/2019 7:28 PM, Fran Giacoma wrote:
I installed the 22” hoses (a mix of with and without brackets) on 120 cars on my September 1956 era layout. Once installed, I paint them Tamiya German Grey XF-63, the closest color of a faded rubber hose in my eyes. I also replace the plastic ones with them when broken.
Fran Giacoma


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Daniel A. Mitchell
 

The only problem I have with the HiTech air hoses is that of fastening them on. The silicon-rubber resists all common adhesives (ACC, Goo, Shoe-Goo, white glue, acetate cement, Gorilla glue, epoxy, bathtub caulk, etc.) … NOTHING sticks to this rubber. The air hoses then simply fall off or get pulled out in service. What does work is to slide a small piece of fine brass tubing over the hose-shank and crimp it on the hose … then glue the tube to the model. This makes a mechanical fastening rather than a glued one. It works. The trick is finding tubing small enough, about 1/32” diam. K&S makes it, but does not sell it through hobby shops. It shows up in their big “grab bags” fairly often. Another possibility would be hypodermic needle stock. I suppose a piece fo flat brass bar stock could also be crimped onto the hose.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On May 21, 2019, at 6:26 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

I’ve used then since they were first introduced with the Precision Scale bracket. The PS brackets have dimple for starting the bit, but the castings aren’t always complete at the U-bolt, so I ‘ve lost a few by drilling through the side of the U-bolt. Start the hole with a #79 bit, then move up to a #77, then a #76. The air pipe on the air hose sometimes has a casting line with flash that interferes with threading it through the U-bold. I ‘ve cut off the flash with a double edge razor blade, which has a thinner blade and is sharper than a single edge razor blade. If the flash is minimal, I taper the end of the air pipe slightly to get it started while threading it into the U-bolt. I bought some YMW air hose brackets to try, but I haven’t used any yet. The detail is better on PS brackets, but the YMW brackets look like it would be easier to thread the air pipe since the hole is drilled before bending, and the metal isn’t as hard to drill.
 
Anybody want to buy a large supply of Kadee plastic air hoses cheap?
 
Nelson Moyer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Richard McQuade via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2019 4:35 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] hi tech HO air hoses
 
I have posted this request with the Early Rails Grp already but thought I would ask this grp too. I'm interested in "investing" in Hi Tech HO freight car air hoses and would like to know what experiences people have had with them. I would be equipping about 80 pieces of rolling stock so this would be a significant expenditure in resources. They offer 22" and 26" lengths in HO. I presume the 22" is for earlier eras  Any info or insights about them would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Richard 



Jack Burgess
 

I have never had a problem with gluing them in place. I think that I have been using canopy glue.

 

Jack Burgess

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2019 7:39 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] hi tech HO air hoses

 

The only problem I have with the HiTech air hoses is that of fastening them on. The silicon-rubber resists all common adhesives (ACC, Goo, Shoe-Goo, white glue, acetate cement, Gorilla glue, epoxy, bathtub caulk, etc.) … NOTHING sticks to this rubber. The air hoses then simply fall off or get pulled out in service. What does work is to slide a small piece of fine brass tubing over the hose-shank and crimp it on the hose … then glue the tube to the model. This makes a mechanical fastening rather than a glued one. It works. The trick is finding tubing small enough, about 1/32” diam. K&S makes it, but does not sell it through hobby shops. It shows up in their big “grab bags” fairly often. Another possibility would be hypodermic needle stock. I suppose a piece fo flat brass bar stock could also be crimped onto the hose.

 

Dan Mitchell

==========



On May 21, 2019, at 6:26 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

 

I’ve used then since they were first introduced with the Precision Scale bracket. The PS brackets have dimple for starting the bit, but the castings aren’t always complete at the U-bolt, so I ‘ve lost a few by drilling through the side of the U-bolt. Start the hole with a #79 bit, then move up to a #77, then a #76. The air pipe on the air hose sometimes has a casting line with flash that interferes with threading it through the U-bold. I ‘ve cut off the flash with a double edge razor blade, which has a thinner blade and is sharper than a single edge razor blade. If the flash is minimal, I taper the end of the air pipe slightly to get it started while threading it into the U-bolt. I bought some YMW air hose brackets to try, but I haven’t used any yet. The detail is better on PS brackets, but the YMW brackets look like it would be easier to thread the air pipe since the hole is drilled before bending, and the metal isn’t as hard to drill.

 

Anybody want to buy a large supply of Kadee plastic air hoses cheap?

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Richard McQuade via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2019 4:35 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] hi tech HO air hoses

 

I have posted this request with the Early Rails Grp already but thought I would ask this grp too. I'm interested in "investing" in Hi Tech HO freight car air hoses and would like to know what experiences people have had with them. I would be equipping about 80 pieces of rolling stock so this would be a significant expenditure in resources. They offer 22" and 26" lengths in HO. I presume the 22" is for earlier eras  Any info or insights about them would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Richard 

 


Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
 

I have never had a problem with gluing them in place. I think that I have been using canopy glue.

Jack Burgess

    Canopy glue is apparently a form of PVA glue.  They call PVA about the same as white glue but it's not.  You can get a gallon of PVA in the UK but apparently not in the US.  I watched a video using it for water.  Anyway try Canopy glue or I recently bought a bottle of Elmer's "Craftbond" Quick Dry Glue that might work.

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, 
SPROG, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Brian Carlson
 

Interesting I’ve never had this problem with CA. I even have a few friction fit and they stay put.  Maybe your holes are too big? 

Brian J. Carlson 

On May 22, 2019, at 10:39 AM, Daniel A. Mitchell <danmitch@...> wrote:

The only problem I have with the HiTech air hoses is that of fastening them on. The silicon-rubber resists all common adhesives (ACC, Goo, Shoe-Goo, white glue, acetate cement, Gorilla glue, epoxy, bathtub caulk, etc.) … NOTHING sticks to this rubber. The air hoses then simply fall off or get pulled out in service. What does work is to slide a small piece of fine brass tubing over the hose-shank and crimp it on the hose … then glue the tube to the model. This makes a mechanical fastening rather than a glued one. It works. The trick is finding tubing small enough, about 1/32” diam. K&S makes it, but does not sell it through hobby shops. It shows up in their big “grab bags” fairly often. Another possibility would be hypodermic needle stock. I suppose a piece fo flat brass bar stock could also be crimped onto the hose.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On May 21, 2019, at 6:26 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

I’ve used then since they were first introduced with the Precision Scale bracket. The PS brackets have dimple for starting the bit, but the castings aren’t always complete at the U-bolt, so I ‘ve lost a few by drilling through the side of the U-bolt. Start the hole with a #79 bit, then move up to a #77, then a #76. The air pipe on the air hose sometimes has a casting line with flash that interferes with threading it through the U-bold. I ‘ve cut off the flash with a double edge razor blade, which has a thinner blade and is sharper than a single edge razor blade. If the flash is minimal, I taper the end of the air pipe slightly to get it started while threading it into the U-bolt. I bought some YMW air hose brackets to try, but I haven’t used any yet. The detail is better on PS brackets, but the YMW brackets look like it would be easier to thread the air pipe since the hole is drilled before bending, and the metal isn’t as hard to drill.
 
Anybody want to buy a large supply of Kadee plastic air hoses cheap?
 
Nelson Moyer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Richard McQuade via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2019 4:35 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] hi tech HO air hoses
 
I have posted this request with the Early Rails Grp already but thought I would ask this grp too. I'm interested in "investing" in Hi Tech HO freight car air hoses and would like to know what experiences people have had with them. I would be equipping about 80 pieces of rolling stock so this would be a significant expenditure in resources. They offer 22" and 26" lengths in HO. I presume the 22" is for earlier eras  Any info or insights about them would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Richard 



Daniel A. Mitchell
 

I have tried “canopy glue” with poor results … unfortunately the term “canopy glue” covers several products from various manufacturers, and they are NOT all the same product. What I have found is very similar to Microscale’s “Crystal clear”, which is just white glue formulated to be clear when dry … it does not stick very well to much of anything (that’s not its purpose).

Dan Mitchell
==========

On May 22, 2019, at 10:58 AM, Jon Miller <atsfus@...> wrote:

I have never had a problem with gluing them in place. I think that I have been using canopy glue.

Jack Burgess

    Canopy glue is apparently a form of PVA glue.  They call PVA about the same as white glue but it's not.  You can get a gallon of PVA in the UK but apparently not in the US.  I watched a video using it for water.  Anyway try Canopy glue or I recently bought a bottle of Elmer's "Craftbond" Quick Dry Glue that might work.

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, 
SPROG, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Nelson Moyer
 

I’ve been using a couple of eye bolts to align the air pipe, giving three points of support, the bracket, and the two eye bolts. Canopy glue seems to work fine in this application.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2019 9:39 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] hi tech HO air hoses

 

The only problem I have with the HiTech air hoses is that of fastening them on. The silicon-rubber resists all common adhesives (ACC, Goo, Shoe-Goo, white glue, acetate cement, Gorilla glue, epoxy, bathtub caulk, etc.) … NOTHING sticks to this rubber. The air hoses then simply fall off or get pulled out in service. What does work is to slide a small piece of fine brass tubing over the hose-shank and crimp it on the hose … then glue the tube to the model. This makes a mechanical fastening rather than a glued one. It works. The trick is finding tubing small enough, about 1/32” diam. K&S makes it, but does not sell it through hobby shops. It shows up in their big “grab bags” fairly often. Another possibility would be hypodermic needle stock. I suppose a piece fo flat brass bar stock could also be crimped onto the hose.

 

Dan Mitchell

==========



On May 21, 2019, at 6:26 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

 

I’ve used then since they were first introduced with the Precision Scale bracket. The PS brackets have dimple for starting the bit, but the castings aren’t always complete at the U-bolt, so I ‘ve lost a few by drilling through the side of the U-bolt. Start the hole with a #79 bit, then move up to a #77, then a #76. The air pipe on the air hose sometimes has a casting line with flash that interferes with threading it through the U-bold. I ‘ve cut off the flash with a double edge razor blade, which has a thinner blade and is sharper than a single edge razor blade. If the flash is minimal, I taper the end of the air pipe slightly to get it started while threading it into the U-bolt. I bought some YMW air hose brackets to try, but I haven’t used any yet. The detail is better on PS brackets, but the YMW brackets look like it would be easier to thread the air pipe since the hole is drilled before bending, and the metal isn’t as hard to drill.

 

Anybody want to buy a large supply of Kadee plastic air hoses cheap?

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Richard McQuade via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2019 4:35 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] hi tech HO air hoses

 

I have posted this request with the Early Rails Grp already but thought I would ask this grp too. I'm interested in "investing" in Hi Tech HO freight car air hoses and would like to know what experiences people have had with them. I would be equipping about 80 pieces of rolling stock so this would be a significant expenditure in resources. They offer 22" and 26" lengths in HO. I presume the 22" is for earlier eras  Any info or insights about them would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Richard 

 


Nelson Moyer
 

Use Pacer Formula 560.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2019 10:26 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] hi tech HO air hoses

 

I have tried “canopy glue” with poor results … unfortunately the term “canopy glue” covers several products from various manufacturers, and they are NOT all the same product. What I have found is very similar to Microscale’s “Crystal clear”, which is just white glue formulated to be clear when dry … it does not stick very well to much of anything (that’s not its purpose).

 

Dan Mitchell

==========



On May 22, 2019, at 10:58 AM, Jon Miller <atsfus@...> wrote:

 

I have never had a problem with gluing them in place. I think that I have been using canopy glue.

Jack Burgess

    Canopy glue is apparently a form of PVA glue.  They call PVA about the same as white glue but it's not.  You can get a gallon of PVA in the UK but apparently not in the US.  I watched a video using it for water.  Anyway try Canopy glue or I recently bought a bottle of Elmer's "Craftbond" Quick Dry Glue that might work.

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, 
SPROG, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS

 


Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
 

On 5/22/2019 8:57 AM, Nelson Moyer wrote:
unfortunately the term “canopy glue” covers several products from various manufacturers, and they are NOT all the same product

    Like I said, more than several, like lots and lots.  Sticky glue belongs in this same family.  They all appear to be variations on PVA glues!

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, 
SPROG, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Tony Thompson
 

Dan Mitchell wrote:

I have tried “canopy glue” with poor results … unfortunately the term “canopy glue” covers several products from various manufacturers, and they are NOT all the same product. What I have found is very similar to Microscale’s “Crystal clear”, which is just white glue formulated to be clear when dry … it does not stick very well to much of anything (that’s not its purpose).

   I strongly disagree. I too have experimented with various products of the "white glue" family, and canopy glue is NOT, repeat NOT, just like any others, including Crystal Clear. Canopy glue is in fact a tenacious adhesive, and is excellent for bonding dissimilar materials, such as wood to plastic, or plastic to metal, etc. And it has the great advantage in some situations that it remains flexible.
     Let me mention one more time my blog post on the topic, which contains some additional detail:

https://modelingthesp.blogspot.com/2013/05/a-few-words-in-praise-of-canopy-glue.html

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






Tony Thompson
 

Jon Miller wrote:

    Like I said, more than several, like lots and lots.  Sticky glue belongs in this same family.  They all appear to be variations on PVA glues!

    Polyvinyl acetate is in lots of glues, as Jon says, but they range very widely, including regular "white glue" and many other products of quite different behaviors, so I am not sure that saying "PVA" tells us much of value about a glue.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history