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is "hogging" a correct word for adjusting truss rod equipped cars

David Wiggs
 

In terms of ships at sea, they exhibit stresses caused by wave action.  Two of these are longitudinal stresses; sagging and hogging which caused by a ship heading though waves and troughs.  Sagging is when the bow and stern are in the wave peaks and the middle is in a trough which bends the middle down, and hogging conversely, is when the bow and stern are in troughs and the middle is on a wave peak which bends the middle up.  So, to tighten the torsion rods to cause an upward bend in the car middle is entirely reasonable to be caused hogging.

davo in Orlando

Robert kirkham
 

Thanks for the responses on this – I learned something!  From now on, tightening will be my word choice. 

 

Rob

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Donald B. Valentine via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2019 4:48 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] is "hogging" a correct word for adjusting truss rod equipped cars

 

Dennis Storzek wrote, "The modern term in car building is camber" and that is the same term that has been used

for heavy haul trailers for years as well. One can see then on any Interstate in the US and Canada any day they choose.

On automobiles, however, the term hjas a different meaning.

 

Cordially, Don Valentine

Donald B. Valentine
 

Dennis Storzek wrote, "The modern term in car building is camber" and that is the same term that has been used
for heavy haul trailers for years as well. One can see then on any Interstate in the US and Canada any day they choose.
On automobiles, however, the term hjas a different meaning.

Cordially, Don Valentine

Charlie Vlk
 

All-

The attached image, although of a baggage car truss rod underframe, shows a camber intentionally built into the unloaded frame.   The second image shows the car loaded up with railroad wheels, straightening it out.  I don’t know if cars were normally built with some camber in the frame but I suspect that they were but perhaps not as extreme for just the wood superstructure and anticipated normal loading for a baggage car.  The truss rods might have been tightened during normal car construction to keep things true and the process not noted anywhere because it was such common practice.

These photos are from the Aurora (Illinois) Shops Test Lab photo album at the Newberry Library Burlington Archives and date from 1903.

Charlie Vlk

 

Jim Betz
 

  My brother worked in trucking in the 70's, 80's, and 90's.  The company
he worked for specialized in flat bed trucks.  They had one guy in the
shop who was the only one who was 'trusted' to re-camber the trailers.
He did so by using a heat gun or torch and causing the linear beams
of the flat bed trailer to regain the proper amount of camber.  When he
was done the trailer had about a 4" to 6" rise in the center (unloaded).
  Pretty much the same idea as "tapping the truss rods to see if they
all had the same tone" ... *G*  My brother did not say that he tapped
the bed/frame with a hammer and listened (but he might have).  What
he did say was that the guy would put the trailer somewhere in the
yard where he could stand back from it and look at the arch.  His
skill was in knowing where to apply heat to get the proper amount
of arch and also not have the trailer "twisted" ... and I'm sure he had
to let it cool before saying "it's done".
                                                                 - Jim B. in Burlington, Wa.

Charles Peck
 

When I was working at the Kentucky Railway Museum, I met an old carman.
He told me he had just started on the railroad the only time he had to deal with truss rods. He said they tightened trussrods by sounding with a hammer.  A dull note was too loose.  One that was sharper than the others was too tight. All should have about the same sound when struck. 
The correct tone is something one learns from experience, I suppose.
Chuck Peck

On Tue, Oct 22, 2019 at 11:04 AM Randy Hees <randyhees@...> wrote:
As suggested, "Hogging" "Hog backed" or "Hogged" are terms, used for wooden railroad cars (mostly flat cars, as the wall truss in box cars make them less susceptible) which have had their truss rods tightened too much.  As noted by others it comes from wooden ships, which would hog because the center of the hull was more buoyant than the ends.

Unlike modern flat semi trailers which are designed with a hog which flattens under load, a hogged railroad car was not desirable.  It generally was thought of as a worn out car, hogged as car inspectors tightened the truss rods as the wooden sills failed, and end beams crushed.  I suspect that a hogged car was more  likely to fail in train service, especially when unloaded, as the train bunched behind them.

I spent nearly 3 months researching how to tighten truss and tension rods for a restoration project.  I read every copy of National Car Builder, every issue of Railroad Gazette, every issue of Railroad Engineering, all the Master Car Builders proceedings, Voss and Kirkman.  There was nothing in writing about how tight a car's truss rods should be tightened, nothing on how to do it (do you jack and block the car straight or can you pull it straight by tightening the truss rods?)  I turned to wood truss bridges, particularly those being rebuilt in modern times with preservation studies... again nothing...  Apparently this was not how that knowledge was taught...  I did find information in interchange rules on how much a railroad could charge if they tightened truss rods or replaced a truss rod on the queen post if became unseated on an off road car,,,  The allowance for tightening as less than the minimum billable amount (but could be charged if other work was done).  resenting a truss rod was independently billable. 

Randy Hees

Randy Hees
 

As suggested, "Hogging" "Hog backed" or "Hogged" are terms, used for wooden railroad cars (mostly flat cars, as the wall truss in box cars make them less susceptible) which have had their truss rods tightened too much.  As noted by others it comes from wooden ships, which would hog because the center of the hull was more buoyant than the ends.

Unlike modern flat semi trailers which are designed with a hog which flattens under load, a hogged railroad car was not desirable.  It generally was thought of as a worn out car, hogged as car inspectors tightened the truss rods as the wooden sills failed, and end beams crushed.  I suspect that a hogged car was more  likely to fail in train service, especially when unloaded, as the train bunched behind them.

I spent nearly 3 months researching how to tighten truss and tension rods for a restoration project.  I read every copy of National Car Builder, every issue of Railroad Gazette, every issue of Railroad Engineering, all the Master Car Builders proceedings, Voss and Kirkman.  There was nothing in writing about how tight a car's truss rods should be tightened, nothing on how to do it (do you jack and block the car straight or can you pull it straight by tightening the truss rods?)  I turned to wood truss bridges, particularly those being rebuilt in modern times with preservation studies... again nothing...  Apparently this was not how that knowledge was taught...  I did find information in interchange rules on how much a railroad could charge if they tightened truss rods or replaced a truss rod on the queen post if became unseated on an off road car,,,  The allowance for tightening as less than the minimum billable amount (but could be charged if other work was done).  resenting a truss rod was independently billable. 

Randy Hees

Dennis Storzek
 

The modern term in car building is camber; TTX flats are built with a camber. However, I can see where in our agrarian past comparisons to the shape of a hog's back could become common terms.

Dennis Storzek 

Nolan Hinshaw
 

On Oct 21, 2019, at 18:13, Charles Peck <@Chuckles> wrote:

I believe that "hogging" would be exactly the correct usage. I have worked on paddlewheel steamboats that had what were called "hog chains" for exactly that same purpose, to take out the sag.
If an empty car is given a slight rise in the middle (a hog back), then when loaded it will flatten out. Loose truss rods allow the car to sag, the opposite
of hogged.
Chuck Peck
Hogging as applied to vessels is what happens to the ends, which are less buoyant than the middle - they sag. The hog chains are to reduce the hogging. Long, faiy sharp wooden hulls in later days had diagonal straps let into the ends to resist hogging; they didn’t always work well enough.

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Charles Peck
 

I believe that "hogging" would be exactly the correct usage. I have worked on paddlewheel steamboats that had what were called "hog chains" for exactly that same purpose, to take out the sag.
If an empty car is given a slight rise in the middle (a hog back), then when loaded it will flatten out.  Loose truss rods allow the car to sag, the opposite 
of hogged. 
Chuck Peck

On Mon, Oct 21, 2019 at 8:55 PM Robert kirkham <rdkirkham@...> wrote:

Off-list, I used the phrase “hogging the car by tightening the truss rods”.  A fellow questioned the word choice, and so I thought I’d ask this group whether they have seen the word used in this context?  What is the correct railroad phrase for the notion of tightening truss rods on a wood frame car so the frame is in tension and has appropriate resistance to the weight of a load?

 

Rob Kirkham 

 

Robert kirkham
 

Off-list, I used the phrase “hogging the car by tightening the truss rods”.  A fellow questioned the word choice, and so I thought I’d ask this group whether they have seen the word used in this context?  What is the correct railroad phrase for the notion of tightening truss rods on a wood frame car so the frame is in tension and has appropriate resistance to the weight of a load?

 

Rob Kirkham