Erie 78500 series boxcars


Schuyler Larrabee
 

I wrote to Brian that I am sure there were cars with BCR ends and black ends.  Model to a photo.  So now he has a photo to justify his modeling work.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of pennsylvania1954
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2019 12:27 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Erie 78500 series boxcars

 

I have sent to Brian a photo of 78601 privately. It shows a reweigh date of 3-57 and has a nice, new, shiny paint job so I assume it was painted 3-57, too. It is clear that the ends are the same shade of boxcar red as the sides.
--
Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL


pennsylvania1954
 

I have sent to Brian a photo of 78601 privately. It shows a reweigh date of 3-57 and has a nice, new, shiny paint job so I assume it was painted 3-57, too. It is clear that the ends are the same shade of boxcar red as the sides.
--
Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL


Schuyler Larrabee
 

Yes, the Des Plaines cars came with black ends.  I looked at mine (unbuilt) to see.  I believe that they were modeling the as-delivered paint.  Mike’s comments about your modeling era ring true, but I think it’s more of an issue that depends on the particular car – some didn’t get repainted for a long time, and there could be >>weathered<< black ends well into the 50s.

 

It’s also conceivable that some shops might have repainted the car and left the ends well enough alone, or might have renewed the black car cement.

 

As I realize you know full well, best to model from a photo . . . which can be pretty hard to find.

 

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Carlson via Groups.Io
Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2019 8:02 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Erie 78500 series boxcars

 

Thanks Mike and everyone else who sent me information on and off list.

 

I was working on the kit at a show this weekend so I didn’t have most of my materials.

 

 I believe what I’m going to do is paint the entire car freight car color and letter it as a reweigh/repaint date in the mid 50s. 

 

I have one of the older Des Plaines cars. But I wanted to do another one. I think des Plaines did theirs with black end but mines put away for the moment.  The Desplaines car was also one of my earlier ones it’ll probably go into the upgrade queue. I think it might even have Kadee air hose brackets, yuck. 

 

Now to determine if the running board was painted. 

 

Also, it looks like intermountain had eight rung ladders with the integrated step so I think I have some of those, otherwise I will try pierre’s ladders

 

Brian J. Carlson 



On Nov 24, 2019, at 7:51 PM, Schleigh Mike via Groups.Io <mike_schleigh@...> wrote:



Hello Brian & Group!

 

In the several responses to Brian's two inquiries about ERIE boxcar painting practices, I believe his basic question has not been resolved, that is:  what would be the color of the repainted ends on the 1940 built 78500-78999 XM cars in the mid-1950s?

 

From my collection I found no help (yet) from boxcar lettering drawings.  Only the stenciling and monogram are referenced with no mention of 'body' color.  This is not the case for other drawings.

 

Several photos in my collection from even the mid to late 1940s suggest that the ends were being repainted in the FCR of the body.  However, new cars were being delivered in the mid-1950s with the black ends.  It would appear that any boxcar repainted by the RR did not receive black ends.  My own (late 1950s and beyond) experience viewing cars on the hometown ERIE did not present black ends at all but photo examples can be found after the 1960 E-L merger.

 

I believe this question has been addressed in the past by the ELRHS but I am not presently able to review that  in back issues of their Diamond but perhaps others have the pertinent ERIE documentation.  For your your needs you would be very safe going with FCR ends on any ERIE boxcar repainted before your late-1950s modeling era.

 

Regards from Grove City, Penna, where winter is returning......Mike Schleigh

 

On Saturday, November 23, 2019, 02:58:28 PM EST, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361@...> wrote:

 

 

Does anyone have a mid 1950 photo of the Erie 78500-78999!cars. Working on a model and trying to determine if the ends were repainted brown or black.

 

Brian J. Carlson

 

 


Brian Carlson
 

Thanks Mike and everyone else who sent me information on and off list.

I was working on the kit at a show this weekend so I didn’t have most of my materials.

 I believe what I’m going to do is paint the entire car freight car color and letter it as a reweigh/repaint date in the mid 50s. 

I have one of the older Des Plaines cars. But I wanted to do another one. I think des Plaines did theirs with black end but mines put away for the moment.  The Desplaines car was also one of my earlier ones it’ll probably go into the upgrade queue. I think it might even have Kadee air hose brackets, yuck. 

Now to determine if the running board was painted. 

Also, it looks like intermountain had eight rung ladders with the integrated step so I think I have some of those, otherwise I will try pierre’s ladders

Brian J. Carlson 

On Nov 24, 2019, at 7:51 PM, Schleigh Mike via Groups.Io <mike_schleigh@...> wrote:


Hello Brian & Group!

In the several responses to Brian's two inquiries about ERIE boxcar painting practices, I believe his basic question has not been resolved, that is:  what would be the color of the repainted ends on the 1940 built 78500-78999 XM cars in the mid-1950s?

From my collection I found no help (yet) from boxcar lettering drawings.  Only the stenciling and monogram are referenced with no mention of 'body' color.  This is not the case for other drawings.

Several photos in my collection from even the mid to late 1940s suggest that the ends were being repainted in the FCR of the body.  However, new cars were being delivered in the mid-1950s with the black ends.  It would appear that any boxcar repainted by the RR did not receive black ends.  My own (late 1950s and beyond) experience viewing cars on the hometown ERIE did not present black ends at all but photo examples can be found after the 1960 E-L merger.

I believe this question has been addressed in the past by the ELRHS but I am not presently able to review that  in back issues of their Diamond but perhaps others have the pertinent ERIE documentation.  For your your needs you would be very safe going with FCR ends on any ERIE boxcar repainted before your late-1950s modeling era.

Regards from Grove City, Penna, where winter is returning......Mike Schleigh

On Saturday, November 23, 2019, 02:58:28 PM EST, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361@...> wrote:


Does anyone have a mid 1950 photo of the Erie 78500-78999!cars. Working on a model and trying to determine if the ends were repainted brown or black.

Brian J. Carlson



Schleigh Mike
 

Hello Brian & Group!

In the several responses to Brian's two inquiries about ERIE boxcar painting practices, I believe his basic question has not been resolved, that is:  what would be the color of the repainted ends on the 1940 built 78500-78999 XM cars in the mid-1950s?

From my collection I found no help (yet) from boxcar lettering drawings.  Only the stenciling and monogram are referenced with no mention of 'body' color.  This is not the case for other drawings.

Several photos in my collection from even the mid to late 1940s suggest that the ends were being repainted in the FCR of the body.  However, new cars were being delivered in the mid-1950s with the black ends.  It would appear that any boxcar repainted by the RR did not receive black ends.  My own (late 1950s and beyond) experience viewing cars on the hometown ERIE did not present black ends at all but photo examples can be found after the 1960 E-L merger.

I believe this question has been addressed in the past by the ELRHS but I am not presently able to review that  in back issues of their Diamond but perhaps others have the pertinent ERIE documentation.  For your your needs you would be very safe going with FCR ends on any ERIE boxcar repainted before your late-1950s modeling era.

Regards from Grove City, Penna, where winter is returning......Mike Schleigh

On Saturday, November 23, 2019, 02:58:28 PM EST, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361@...> wrote:


Does anyone have a mid 1950 photo of the Erie 78500-78999!cars. Working on a model and trying to determine if the ends were repainted brown or black.

Brian J. Carlson



 

I'll answer my own question.

Running board / brake step, Apex Tri-lok

Handbrake, Ajax

Link to Ed's table for 1937 40' AAR Boxcars

http://steamerafreightcars.com/prototype/frtcars/1937aarmain.html

Dan Smith


 

Link to Trainlife file Garth references:

http://magazine.trainlife.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/rmj_199107.pdf

Article begins on page 42.

This car was done as a Des Plaines IMWX / RC kit, without the B-1 trucks.

Running board type? Handbrake?

Dan Smith


Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Al and Brian,

The builder's photos of 78500 (side and A-end) are on page 44 of Ed Hawkins' article "1937 AAR Boxcars built by ACF" in the July 1991 RAILMODEL JOURNAL. Ed said there was no chip available for the side color, but suggested Floquil ATSF Mineral Brown (allied roads NKP, C&O and PM also ordered these cars, and he specifies that paint color as the closest match for those roads). The Viking roof, underframe and National Type-B trucks were black.

Hope this is useful.


Yours Aye,

Garth Groff


On Sun, Nov 24, 2019 at 3:20 PM Allan Smith <smithal9@...> wrote:

Try the Protocraft decal website under Erie 1937 boxcars. There is a photo of 78500 and a description of black car cement on the ends.


Al Smith
Sonora Ca
On Sunday, November 24, 2019, 08:39:45 AM PST, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:


Follow up does intermountain make 8 rung ladders for the end of the car 1937 AAR car.

My undec kit came with 8 rung ladders for the side but not the ends

Brian J. Carlson
> On Nov 23, 2019, at 2:58 PM, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
>
> Does anyone have a mid 1950 photo of the Erie 78500-78999!cars. Working on a model and trying to determine if the ends were repainted brown or black.
>
> Brian J. Carlson
>
>
>




Schuyler Larrabee
 

Having just gone through (and mostly deleted) all my email from last Thursday on, I was about to research this question for Brian, but Al has saved me the trouble.  I can confirm that he’s correct about this, however.  As to the follow-up about 8 rung ladders for the end . . . I think so.  My Shake’n’Take is based on that car, and came with an 8 rung ladder.  However, sometimes it seems that IM sends out these kits with a different end, so that might be the issue.  The car I did was from the 98500 series.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Allan Smith
Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2019 3:20 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Erie 78500 series boxcars

 

 

Try the Protocraft decal website under Erie 1937 boxcars. There is a photo of 78500 and a description of black car cement on the ends.

 

 

Al Smith

Sonora Ca

On Sunday, November 24, 2019, 08:39:45 AM PST, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361@...> wrote:

 

 

Follow up does intermountain make 8 rung ladders for the end of the car 1937 AAR car.

 

My undec kit came with 8 rung ladders for the side but not the ends

 

Brian J. Carlson

> On Nov 23, 2019, at 2:58 PM, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

>

> Does anyone have a mid 1950 photo of the Erie 78500-78999!cars. Working on a model and trying to determine if the ends were repainted brown or black.

>

> Brian J. Carlson

>

>

>

 

 

 


Allan Smith
 


Try the Protocraft decal website under Erie 1937 boxcars. There is a photo of 78500 and a description of black car cement on the ends.


Al Smith
Sonora Ca

On Sunday, November 24, 2019, 08:39:45 AM PST, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361@...> wrote:


Follow up does intermountain make 8 rung ladders for the end of the car 1937 AAR car.

My undec kit came with 8 rung ladders for the side but not the ends

Brian J. Carlson
> On Nov 23, 2019, at 2:58 PM, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
>
> Does anyone have a mid 1950 photo of the Erie 78500-78999!cars. Working on a model and trying to determine if the ends were repainted brown or black.
>
> Brian J. Carlson
>
>
>




Brian Carlson
 

Follow up does intermountain make 8 rung ladders for the end of the car 1937 AAR car.

My undec kit came with 8 rung ladders for the side but not the ends

Brian J. Carlson

On Nov 23, 2019, at 2:58 PM, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361@...> wrote:

Does anyone have a mid 1950 photo of the Erie 78500-78999!cars. Working on a model and trying to determine if the ends were repainted brown or black.

Brian J. Carlson



Brian Carlson
 

Does anyone have a mid 1950 photo of the Erie 78500-78999!cars. Working on a model and trying to determine if the ends were repainted brown or black.

Brian J. Carlson