Milk cars


Roger Huber <trainpainter@...>
 

Did anyone besides Borden use the butterdish style cars?

Roger Huber


Don Burn
 

If you mean ones that match the F&C kit.  The answer is no, those were a unique Borden design.  There were at least two GPEX cars that used a similar arrangement but were visibly different.

 

Don Burn

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Huber via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 3:58 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars

 

Did anyone besides Borden use the butterdish style cars?

Roger Huber


Donald B. Valentine <riverman_vt@...>
 

That is correct Don. You are refering specifically to GPEX #803 and #804 both of which 
were rebuilds of earlier wood sheathed milk tank cars. General American used a cover
for the two 3,000 gal. tanks each on these two cars that was similar to, but different, from 
that used by the cars that Borden owned outright. The two GPEX cars were leased to
H.P. Hood & Sons thus being seen in service only in New England or as far out of it as 
the large Hood plant in Eagle Bridge, NY. If someone needs a photo to show the 
difference between the two Hood cars and the Borden cars I could post photos of the two
Hood cars with some guidance as I've had no luck in doing so since the change was made
to groups.io. I have both builder's photos and in service photos of the two Hood cars and 
expect everyone knows what the Borden cars looked like.

Cordially, Don Valentine


Roger Huber <trainpainter@...>
 

Don,

Would you please send photos of the 803-804 cars? Does anyone make an HO model of them?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 09:08:35 AM CDT, Donald B. Valentine via groups.io <riverman_vt@...> wrote:


That is correct Don. You are refering specifically to GPEX #803 and #804 both of which 
were rebuilds of earlier wood sheathed milk tank cars. General American used a cover
for the two 3,000 gal. tanks each on these two cars that was similar to, but different, from 
that used by the cars that Borden owned outright. The two GPEX cars were leased to
H.P. Hood & Sons thus being seen in service only in New England or as far out of it as 
the large Hood plant in Eagle Bridge, NY. If someone needs a photo to show the 
difference between the two Hood cars and the Borden cars I could post photos of the two
Hood cars with some guidance as I've had no luck in doing so since the change was made
to groups.io. I have both builder's photos and in service photos of the two Hood cars and 
expect everyone knows what the Borden cars looked like.

Cordially, Don Valentine


Allen Cain
 

Roger 

Arriving a little late to this discussion but I have some H.P. Hood & Sons milk cars that I would like to sell.  Need to check when I get home but THINK they were made by Intermountain or BrNchline?  Have at least two and maybe more. Also have the dame car in some other lines.

If anyone is interested contact me off list and I will dig them out and make a deal.

Allen Cain


Don Burn
 

Allen,

 

       The Intermountain cars are standard GPEX cars, not the “butterdish like” GPEX 803 and 804 see the picture on the top of the cover of https://www.riverraisinmodels.com/libraryData/milktrains.pdf

 

Don Burn

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Allen Cain
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 5:28 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars

 

Roger 

 

Arriving a little late to this discussion but I have some H.P. Hood & Sons milk cars that I would like to sell.  Need to check when I get home but THINK they were made by Intermountain or BrNchline?  Have at least two and maybe more. Also have the dame car in some other lines.

 

If anyone is interested contact me off list and I will dig them out and make a deal.

 

Allen Cain


Roger Huber <trainpainter@...>
 

Don,

The GPEX 803-804 cars are really different! I like those. Do you know if anyone makes kits or RTR in HO?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 04:42:33 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@...> wrote:


Allen,

 

       The Intermountain cars are standard GPEX cars, not the “butterdish like” GPEX 803 and 804 see the picture on the top of the cover of https://www.riverraisinmodels.com/libraryData/milktrains.pdf

 

Don Burn

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Allen Cain
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 5:28 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars

 

Roger 

 

Arriving a little late to this discussion but I have some H.P. Hood & Sons milk cars that I would like to sell.  Need to check when I get home but THINK they were made by Intermountain or BrNchline?  Have at least two and maybe more. Also have the dame car in some other lines.

 

If anyone is interested contact me off list and I will dig them out and make a deal.

 

Allen Cain


Don Burn
 

There was talk of a possible resin kit 10 years ago, but as far as I know it was never done.

Don Burn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Huber via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 6:38 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars

Don,

The GPEX 803-804 cars are really different! I like those. Do you know if anyone makes kits or RTR in HO?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 04:42:33 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@...> wrote:



Allen,



The Intermountain cars are standard GPEX cars, not the “butterdish like” GPEX 803 and 804 see the picture on the top of the cover of https://www.riverraisinmodels.com/libraryData/milktrains.pdf



Don Burn





From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Allen Cain
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 5:28 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars



Roger



Arriving a little late to this discussion but I have some H.P. Hood & Sons milk cars that I would like to sell. Need to check when I get home but THINK they were made by Intermountain or BrNchline? Have at least two and maybe more. Also have the dame car in some other lines.



If anyone is interested contact me off list and I will dig them out and make a deal.



Allen Cain


Roger Huber <trainpainter@...>
 

Bummer!

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 05:51:28 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@...> wrote:


There was talk of a possible resin kit 10 years ago, but as far as I know it was never done.

Don Burn


-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Huber via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 6:38 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars

Don,

The GPEX 803-804 cars are really different! I like those. Do you know if anyone makes kits or RTR in HO?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 04:42:33 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@...> wrote:



Allen,



      The Intermountain cars are standard GPEX cars, not the “butterdish like” GPEX 803 and 804 see the picture on the top of the cover of https://www.riverraisinmodels.com/libraryData/milktrains.pdf



Don Burn





From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Allen Cain
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 5:28 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars



Roger



Arriving a little late to this discussion but I have some H.P. Hood & Sons milk cars that I would like to sell.  Need to check when I get home but THINK they were made by Intermountain or BrNchline?  Have at least two and maybe more. Also have the dame car in some other lines.



If anyone is interested contact me off list and I will dig them out and make a deal.



Allen Cain






Roger Huber <trainpainter@...>
 

I have 4 of the Roundhouse 40' GPEX wooden Pfaulder cars. They are very nice cars with, I'm sure, many faults but I like them. I was just looking for some bulk cars with a bit more looks appeal to them. I like the rounded top/bottom GPEX metal Pfaudler cars too.

I need to find some can cars with more appeal too. I need 40' cars so the Walthers, Athearn & BLI cars don't work for me.

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 05:51:28 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@...> wrote:


There was talk of a possible resin kit 10 years ago, but as far as I know it was never done.

Don Burn


-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Huber via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 6:38 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars

Don,

The GPEX 803-804 cars are really different! I like those. Do you know if anyone makes kits or RTR in HO?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 04:42:33 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@...> wrote:



Allen,



      The Intermountain cars are standard GPEX cars, not the “butterdish like” GPEX 803 and 804 see the picture on the top of the cover of https://www.riverraisinmodels.com/libraryData/milktrains.pdf



Don Burn





From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Allen Cain
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 5:28 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars



Roger



Arriving a little late to this discussion but I have some H.P. Hood & Sons milk cars that I would like to sell.  Need to check when I get home but THINK they were made by Intermountain or BrNchline?  Have at least two and maybe more. Also have the dame car in some other lines.



If anyone is interested contact me off list and I will dig them out and make a deal.



Allen Cain






Don Burn
 

Roger,

If you are not aware of it check out http://users.rcn.com/jimdu4/MilkTrains/modelingmilk.htm

Don Burn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Huber via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 7:00 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars

I have 4 of the Roundhouse 40' GPEX wooden Pfaulder cars. They are very nice cars with, I'm sure, many faults but I like them. I was just looking for some bulk cars with a bit more looks appeal to them. I like the rounded top/bottom GPEX metal Pfaudler cars too.

I need to find some can cars with more appeal too. I need 40' cars so the Walthers, Athearn & BLI cars don't work for me.

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 05:51:28 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@...> wrote:


There was talk of a possible resin kit 10 years ago, but as far as I know it was never done.

Don Burn


-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> ] On Behalf Of Roger Huber via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 6:38 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars

Don,

The GPEX 803-804 cars are really different! I like those. Do you know if anyone makes kits or RTR in HO?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 04:42:33 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@... <mailto:burn@...> > wrote:



Allen,



The Intermountain cars are standard GPEX cars, not the “butterdish like” GPEX 803 and 804 see the picture on the top of the cover of https://www.riverraisinmodels.com/libraryData/milktrains.pdf <https://www.riverraisinmodels.com/libraryData/milktrains.pdf>



Don Burn





From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> ] On Behalf Of Allen Cain
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 5:28 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io <mailto:main@realstmfc.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars



Roger



Arriving a little late to this discussion but I have some H.P. Hood & Sons milk cars that I would like to sell. Need to check when I get home but THINK they were made by Intermountain or BrNchline? Have at least two and maybe more. Also have the dame car in some other lines.



If anyone is interested contact me off list and I will dig them out and make a deal.



Allen Cain


Roger Huber <trainpainter@...>
 

Lots of info there! Thanks!

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 06:12:52 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@...> wrote:


Roger,

    If you are not aware of it check out http://users.rcn.com/jimdu4/MilkTrains/modelingmilk.htm

Don Burn


-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Roger Huber via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 7:00 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars

I have 4 of the Roundhouse 40' GPEX wooden Pfaulder cars. They are very nice cars with, I'm sure, many faults but I like them. I was just looking for some bulk cars with a bit more looks appeal to them. I like the rounded top/bottom GPEX metal Pfaudler cars too.

I need to find some can cars with more appeal too. I need 40' cars so the Walthers, Athearn & BLI cars don't work for me.

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 05:51:28 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@...> wrote:


There was talk of a possible resin kit 10 years ago, but as far as I know it was never done.

Don Burn


-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>  [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> ] On Behalf Of Roger Huber via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 6:38 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars

Don,

The GPEX 803-804 cars are really different! I like those. Do you know if anyone makes kits or RTR in HO?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 04:42:33 PM CDT, Don Burn <burn@... <mailto:burn@...> > wrote:



Allen,



      The Intermountain cars are standard GPEX cars, not the “butterdish like” GPEX 803 and 804 see the picture on the top of the cover of https://www.riverraisinmodels.com/libraryData/milktrains.pdf <https://www.riverraisinmodels.com/libraryData/milktrains.pdf>



Don Burn





From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>  [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> ] On Behalf Of Allen Cain
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 5:28 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io <mailto:main@realstmfc.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Milk cars



Roger



Arriving a little late to this discussion but I have some H.P. Hood & Sons milk cars that I would like to sell.  Need to check when I get home but THINK they were made by Intermountain or BrNchline?  Have at least two and maybe more. Also have the dame car in some other lines.



If anyone is interested contact me off list and I will dig them out and make a deal.



Allen Cain











Donald B. Valentine <riverman_vt@...>
 

    I'm sorry, Roger, but think you're out of luck in finding a model of the two GPEX - H.P. Hood
"butterdish" style cars short of scratchbuilt ones.

My best, Don Valentine


Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Friends,

Thought different from the Hood cars, F&C offers a National Car Co. prototype with milk containers (and freight containers too).


Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆


On Tue, May 12, 2020 at 7:37 PM Donald B. Valentine via groups.io <riverman_vt=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
    I'm sorry, Roger, but think you're out of luck in finding a model of the two GPEX - H.P. Hood
"butterdish" style cars short of scratchbuilt ones.

My best, Don Valentine


Allen Cain
 

Didn't F&C make these years ago?  I think I may have two kits stashed away?

Not on their current list.

Allen Cain


Donald B. Valentine <riverman_vt@...>
 

That's correct Don.It was more like 15 years ago but I couldn't get enough interest to warrant
the work and investment for a two car prototype.

My best, Don Valentine


Donald B. Valentine <riverman_vt@...>
 


Roger Huber wrote: 

"I have 4 of the Roundhouse 40' GPEX wooden Pfaulder cars. They are very nice cars with, I'm sure, many faults but I like them. I was just looking for some bulk cars with a bit more looks appeal to them. I like the rounded top/bottom GPEX metal Pfaudler cars too.

I need to find some can cars with more appeal too. I need 40' cars so the Walthers, Athearn & BLI cars don't work for me."


    Roger, what roads and milk processors do you seek cars for. Perhaps I can assist further with that info having organized three weekend long milk car meets in the early 2000's and lost count of the number of milk car clinics provided. The Roundhouse- Athearn 40 ft.milk car is the best one in styrene IMO. The Walthers car is also fine if
you remove the rivets on the side of the car that anchored the ice bunker in the refrigerated express reefer version. The InterMountain GPEX milk car even has the correct rivet count but the slope of the roof is just plain WRONG which they were told before it went into production so the Wegmann reefer folks are not the only ones disgusted with InterMountain. The old Roundhouse 50 ft. car models a Lehigh Valley prototype but I cannot so how well or not so well. The Athearn express reefer from the late 1960's is also useable. I removed the ice hatch hinges, smoothed up the roof, covered the ice hatch holes with cellophane tape and filled the holes with two part epoxy from the inside of the carbody when these cars were released and lived with them for some years. The Athearn carbody can be reduced to 40 ft. in length and modified a bit to make an acceptable to most model of a CV can type of milk car used more in freight than passenger service on the CV. Of the brass milk cars available beware of the 50 ft. PSC wood sheathed car for which I've never found a prototype though the 40ft. version is a swell model.

My best, Don Valentine


Roger Huber <trainpainter@...>
 

Hi, Don.

I like those Roundhouse 40' Pfaudler cars a lot. They look good to me. The round top/bottom 40' car is neat too but I need some can cars. I don't like the looks of the old MDC/Roundhouse cars. They are too squat looking for my tastes.

I was thinking of taking the Athearn 50' express reefer and cutting the ends off then cutting at the I/B ends of the ice hatches and then putting it all back together as a shorter, approx 40', car. 

I'm wanting something for my layout for a dairy that uses both can and bulk cars. Nothing prototypical except the name of a dairy from my home town. They had no rail service but I want to include milk cars so why not? The normal operating scheme would require 2 can and 2 bulk cars.

Thanks for your help and links.

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Tuesday, May 12, 2020, 08:49:17 PM CDT, Donald B. Valentine via groups.io <riverman_vt@...> wrote:



Roger Huber wrote: 

"I have 4 of the Roundhouse 40' GPEX wooden Pfaulder cars. They are very nice cars with, I'm sure, many faults but I like them. I was just looking for some bulk cars with a bit more looks appeal to them. I like the rounded top/bottom GPEX metal Pfaudler cars too.

I need to find some can cars with more appeal too. I need 40' cars so the Walthers, Athearn & BLI cars don't work for me."


    Roger, what roads and milk processors do you seek cars for. Perhaps I can assist further with that info having organized three weekend long milk car meets in the early 2000's and lost count of the number of milk car clinics provided. The Roundhouse- Athearn 40 ft.milk car is the best one in styrene IMO. The Walthers car is also fine if
you remove the rivets on the side of the car that anchored the ice bunker in the refrigerated express reefer version. The InterMountain GPEX milk car even has the correct rivet count but the slope of the roof is just plain WRONG which they were told before it went into production so the Wegmann reefer folks are not the only ones disgusted with InterMountain. The old Roundhouse 50 ft. car models a Lehigh Valley prototype but I cannot so how well or not so well. The Athearn express reefer from the late 1960's is also useable. I removed the ice hatch hinges, smoothed up the roof, covered the ice hatch holes with cellophane tape and filled the holes with two part epoxy from the inside of the carbody when these cars were released and lived with them for some years. The Athearn carbody can be reduced to 40 ft. in length and modified a bit to make an acceptable to most model of a CV can type of milk car used more in freight than passenger service on the CV. Of the brass milk cars available beware of the 50 ft. PSC wood sheathed car for which I've never found a prototype though the 40ft. version is a swell model.

My best, Don Valentine