Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola
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Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728 This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit. My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip. Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA |
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Riverboy
Beautiful photo. It's interesting to note that over the last year, ALL of the Buckeye Steel buildings have been torn down, and the entire property is being cleaned up and will eventually be redeveloped. I moved from Massachusetts to Ohio in 1993 when I was 25, and moved just south of Columbus in 1995 when I bought my house, and after over 20 years of seeing the complex there, busy with all kinds of activity, along with a smell that was a lot like a burning clutch or burning brakes, the property is now vacant and void of all the structures. It looks so "wrong". Kind of sad in a way. A lot of history is now gone. Tod C Dwyer Lockbourne/Shadeville Ohio
On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 12:54:21 PM EDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:
Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728 This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit. My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip. Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA |
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The amazing thing was that Columbus Steel Castings (the successor to Buckeye) was the largest steel foundry under one roof in North America in the last couple of decades. Not something you normally associate Columbus with.
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My model railroad club, on which I pulled steam era freight cars, was on the grounds (in the old ARMCO executive building) from 1969 until 2016-ish, when we were finally asked to leave, so I’ve long had a soft spot for the facility. Matt Goodman Columbus, Ohio On May 23, 2020, at 1:09 PM, Riverboy via groups.io <river_dweller_ohio@...> wrote:
Beautiful photo. It's interesting to note that over the last year, ALL of the Buckeye Steel buildings have been torn down, and the entire property is being cleaned up and will eventually be redeveloped. I moved from Massachusetts to Ohio in 1993 when I was 25, and moved just south of Columbus in 1995 when I bought my house, and after over 20 years of seeing the complex there, busy with all kinds of activity, along with a smell that was a lot like a burning clutch or burning brakes, the property is now vacant and void of all the structures. It looks so "wrong". Kind of sad in a way. A lot of history is now gone. Tod C Dwyer Lockbourne/Shadeville Ohio
On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 12:54:21 PM EDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:
Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728 This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit. My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip. Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA |
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I am trying to figure out who built this car. It says 1912 and BSC Co and Johnstown on its side. Pressed Steel built cars for Buckeye, but only in about 1920 and later cars were built by Ralston.
Thoughts? Steve Hile
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Matt Goodman via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 12:21 PM To: main@realstmfc.groups.io Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola
The amazing thing was that Columbus Steel Castings (the successor to Buckeye) was the largest steel foundry under one roof in North America in the last couple of decades. Not something you normally associate Columbus with.
My model railroad club, on which I pulled steam era freight cars, was on the grounds (in the old ARMCO executive building) from 1969 until 2016-ish, when we were finally asked to leave, so I’ve long had a soft spot for the facility. Matt Goodman Columbus, Ohio
Sent from my mobile
Beautiful photo.
It's interesting to note that over the last year, ALL of the Buckeye Steel buildings have been torn down, and the entire property is being cleaned up and will eventually be redeveloped. I moved from Massachusetts to Ohio in 1993 when I was 25, and moved just south of Columbus in 1995 when I bought my house, and after over 20 years of seeing the complex there, busy with all kinds of activity, along with a smell that was a lot like a burning clutch or burning brakes, the property is now vacant and void of all the structures. It looks so "wrong". Kind of sad in a way. A lot of history is now gone.
Tod C Dwyer
Lockbourne/Shadeville Ohio
On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 12:54:21 PM EDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:
Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728 This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit. My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip. Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA |
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Dave Parker
Steve, I'm not sure I understand your question. BSC was Bethlehem Steel in Johnstown, PA. I haven't seen their name on a lot of cars, but they did build ~5 of the X29 lots in the 1924-30 time frame, among others . I'm guessing they had a car-building division, thus the "B.S.C.Co." stencil on this car.
Best regards. -- Dave Parker Swall Meadows, CA |
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Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
Hi Bob and List Members,
I’ve not done a rivet-by-rivet comparison, but it looks like it is
identical to and built to the PRR class GS design – see link below.
Claus Schlund
From: Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 12:54 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer
Gondola Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728 This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit. My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip. Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA |
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Riverboy
Hello again. I had to go through my files, but I knew I had taken a photo about ten to fifteen years ago, when I was selling scrap at a nearby facility that is on the access road next to the steel plant, and I'm not sure, but it could be the same car, or one from the same series of cars. It looks similar but has been super patched and everything over the years. I could be wrong though. I apologize for the poor quality of the photo, but it was an early digital camera, long before there were smart phones with good cameras.
On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 01:33:19 PM EDT, Steve and Barb Hile <shile@...> wrote:
I am trying to figure out who built this car. It says 1912 and BSC Co and Johnstown on its side. Pressed Steel built cars for Buckeye, but only in about 1920 and later cars were built by Ralston.
Thoughts? Steve Hile
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Matt Goodman via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 12:21 PM To: main@realstmfc.groups.io Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola
The amazing thing was that Columbus Steel Castings (the successor to Buckeye) was the largest steel foundry under one roof in North America in the last couple of decades. Not something you normally associate Columbus with.
My model railroad club, on which I pulled steam era freight cars, was on the grounds (in the old ARMCO executive building) from 1969 until 2016-ish, when we were finally asked to leave, so I’ve long had a soft spot for the facility. Matt Goodman Columbus, Ohio
Sent from my mobile
Beautiful photo.
It's interesting to note that over the last year, ALL of the Buckeye Steel buildings have been torn down, and the entire property is being cleaned up and will eventually be redeveloped. I moved from Massachusetts to Ohio in 1993 when I was 25, and moved just south of Columbus in 1995 when I bought my house, and after over 20 years of seeing the complex there, busy with all kinds of activity, along with a smell that was a lot like a burning clutch or burning brakes, the property is now vacant and void of all the structures. It looks so "wrong". Kind of sad in a way. A lot of history is now gone.
Tod C Dwyer
Lockbourne/Shadeville Ohio
On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 12:54:21 PM EDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:
Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728 This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit. My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip. Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA |
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Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
Hi List Members,
Here is a second photo showing a similar (same?) gondola...
Claus Schlund
From: Claus Schlund
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 1:43 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer
Gondola Hi Bob and List Members,
I’ve not done a rivet-by-rivet comparison, but it looks like it is
identical to and built to the PRR class GS design – see link below.
Claus Schlund
From: Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 12:54 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer
Gondola Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728 This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit. My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip. Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA |
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According to the car builder’s listing at Mid Continent Railway Museum
https://midcontinent.org/rollingstock/list/bldr_list_C.htm#C
the Bethlehem Steel facility at Johnstown doesn’t begin until circa 1922. That facility in 1912 was Cambria Steel with a brief name of Midvale before Bethlehem got it.
That’s where my confusion lies.
Steve Hile
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dave Parker via groups.io
Steve, I'm not sure I understand your question. BSC was Bethlehem Steel in Johnstown, PA. I haven't seen their name on a lot of cars, but they did build ~5 of the X29 lots in the 1924-30 time frame, among others . I'm guessing they had a car-building division, thus the "B.S.C.Co." stencil on this car. |
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Dave Parker
Steve:
Ahh. Now I get it it. Indeed, the history of the Johnstown facility indicates that it was Cambria when this car was built, then briefly Midvale before the Bethlehem acquisition in 1923. So here's the alternative: The BSCCo stencil refers Buckeye Steel Castings Company, who produced a wide array of steel (earlier iron) castings for the railroad industry. It seems this isn't an interchange car as there is no car number. Perhaps it was built by Cambria for Buckeye to custom specs and/or design. It is a 70-ton car, not something I think of as being very common in 1912. That's the best I can come up with in the SWAG department. Best regards. -- Dave Parker Swall Meadows, CA |
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Makes sense to me. I can see a number 10 on the car, also.
From what I can see in Eric Neubauer’s builder’s listings. Pressed Steel car built six 55 ton cars (perhaps hoppers?) in 1920. Ralston (also in Columbus) built eighteen 70 ton gondolas for BSCCo in 1920 and 12 more in 1930. Pullman Standard tagged along eight 50 ton, 40’6” seven post gondolas numbered 60-67 to an SP&S order lot 5944, as lot 5944A.
Apparently these were all in captive in-plant service as there are not ORER records that I could find (quickly) for Buckeye Steel.
Steve Hile
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dave Parker via groups.io
Steve: |
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David
The stencil had me scratching my head, too, but I think it is for Buckeye since Bethlehem didn't merge Cambria/Midvale until 1922.
Here is a second photo showing a similar (same?) gondola...That one is a Hocking Valley car: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/67531 David Thompson |
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Schuyler Larrabee
Not about the car in the subject line . . .
Were the records of Buckeye (and Columbus Steel Castings) preserved at all? I don’t remember what I was after – might have been for a locomotive driver center - but I once contacted them and they said if I >>REALLY<< needed it, they had the drawings I was interested in at the time, but it would probably take a couple man days to locate them. Was I willing to pay for that?
Ah, nooooo.
But I still wonder if they were preserved.
Schuyler
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Matt Goodman via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 1:21 PM To: main@realstmfc.groups.io Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola
The amazing thing was that Columbus Steel Castings (the successor to Buckeye) was the largest steel foundry under one roof in North America in the last couple of decades. Not something you normally associate Columbus with.
My model railroad club, on which I pulled steam era freight cars, was on the grounds (in the old ARMCO executive building) from 1969 until 2016-ish, when we were finally asked to leave, so I’ve long had a soft spot for the facility. Matt Goodman Columbus, Ohio
Sent from my mobile
Beautiful photo.
It's interesting to note that over the last year, ALL of the Buckeye Steel buildings have been torn down, and the entire property is being cleaned up and will eventually be redeveloped. I moved from Massachusetts to Ohio in 1993 when I was 25, and moved just south of Columbus in 1995 when I bought my house, and after over 20 years of seeing the complex there, busy with all kinds of activity, along with a smell that was a lot like a burning clutch or burning brakes, the property is now vacant and void of all the structures. It looks so "wrong". Kind of sad in a way. A lot of history is now gone.
Tod C Dwyer
Lockbourne/Shadeville Ohio
On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 12:54:21 PM EDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:
Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728 This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit. My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip. Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA |
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brianleppert@att.net
FWIW, the journal box lids on the trucks under this gondola all have a cast on foundry mark. A "B" inside a circle. That stands for the Buckeye Steel Castings Co.
Brian Leppert Tahoe Model Works Carson City, NV |
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Schuyler,
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The plant’s environmental manager took the president of the club and I through Buckeye's office building about a year after the facility had been purchased at bankruptcy auction and shortly before it started being dismantled. To her credit, she was concerned that a lot of history would be lost in the rubble and was hoping we could help rescue things of value (either directly or through people we knew). I asked about specifically about drawings. Buckeye (then Columbus Steel Castings) had would have had some very interesting casting drawings though their and their predecessors work (including locomotive frames and steam era freight car trucks and couplers). Her story was that the winning bidder (a competitor in the industry) had immediately taken possession of the IP (drawings, etc.) and destroyed them, for reasons I don’t quite understand. What a loss. I picked up some grounds drawings that day, and other materials were later rescued by the local historical society. Again, as far as I know, the really cool stuff went to the the shredder. With luck the “shredder” means some bigwig took them into their personal collection! Matt Goodman Columbus, Ohio US On May 23, 2020, at 5:51 PM, Schuyler Larrabee via groups.io <schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote: Not about the car in the subject line . . . Were the records of Buckeye (and Columbus Steel Castings) preserved at all? I don’t remember what I was after – might have been for a locomotive driver center - but I once contacted them and they said if I >>REALLY<< needed it, they had the drawings I was interested in at the time, but it would probably take a couple man days to locate them. Was I willing to pay for that? Ah, nooooo. But I still wonder if they were preserved. Schuyler From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Matt Goodman via groups.io Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 1:21 PM To: main@realstmfc.groups.io Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola The amazing thing was that Columbus Steel Castings (the successor to Buckeye) was the largest steel foundry under one roof in North America in the last couple of decades. Not something you normally associate Columbus with. My model railroad club, on which I pulled steam era freight cars, was on the grounds (in the old ARMCO executive building) from 1969 until 2016-ish, when we were finally asked to leave, so I’ve long had a soft spot for the facility. Matt Goodman Columbus, Ohio Sent from my mobile
Beautiful photo. It's interesting to note that over the last year, ALL of the Buckeye Steel buildings have been torn down, and the entire property is being cleaned up and will eventually be redeveloped. I moved from Massachusetts to Ohio in 1993 when I was 25, and moved just south of Columbus in 1995 when I bought my house, and after over 20 years of seeing the complex there, busy with all kinds of activity, along with a smell that was a lot like a burning clutch or burning brakes, the property is now vacant and void of all the structures. It looks so "wrong". Kind of sad in a way. A lot of history is now gone. Tod C Dwyer Lockbourne/Shadeville Ohio On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 12:54:21 PM EDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728 This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit. My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip. Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA |
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Schuyler Larrabee
Well, thanks Matt, for the answer. But what a crushing blow to know that all that information is lost to history.
One thing I was interested in was the drawings of the one-piece locomotive frames that Commonwealth made in the steam era. It is my understanding that the technology to make those is lost, and cannot be reproduced today.
Schuyler
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Matt Goodman via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, May 28, 2020 7:05 PM To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola
Schuyler,
The plant’s environmental manager took the president of the club and I through Buckeye's office building about a year after the facility had been purchased at bankruptcy auction and shortly before it started being dismantled. To her credit, she was concerned that a lot of history would be lost in the rubble and was hoping we could help rescue things of value (either directly or through people we knew).
I asked about specifically about drawings. Buckeye (then Columbus Steel Castings) had would have had some very interesting casting drawings though their and their predecessors work (including locomotive frames and steam era freight car trucks and couplers). Her story was that the winning bidder (a competitor in the industry) had immediately taken possession of the IP (drawings, etc.) and destroyed them, for reasons I don’t quite understand. What a loss.
I picked up some grounds drawings that day, and other materials were later rescued by the local historical society. Again, as far as I know, the really cool stuff went to the the shredder. With luck the “shredder” means some bigwig took them into their personal collection!
Matt Goodman Columbus, Ohio US
On May 23, 2020, at 5:51 PM, Schuyler Larrabee via groups.io <schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote:
Not about the car in the subject line . . .
Were the records of Buckeye (and Columbus Steel Castings) preserved at all? I don’t remember what I was after – might have been for a locomotive driver center - but I once contacted them and they said if I >>REALLY<< needed it, they had the drawings I was interested in at the time, but it would probably take a couple man days to locate them. Was I willing to pay for that?
Ah, nooooo.
But I still wonder if they were preserved.
Schuyler
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Matt Goodman via groups.io
The amazing thing was that Columbus Steel Castings (the successor to Buckeye) was the largest steel foundry under one roof in North America in the last couple of decades. Not something you normally associate Columbus with.
My model railroad club, on which I pulled steam era freight cars, was on the grounds (in the old ARMCO executive building) from 1969 until 2016-ish, when we were finally asked to leave, so I’ve long had a soft spot for the facility. Matt Goodman Columbus, Ohio
Sent from my mobile
Beautiful photo.
It's interesting to note that over the last year, ALL of the Buckeye Steel buildings have been torn down, and the entire property is being cleaned up and will eventually be redeveloped. I moved from Massachusetts to Ohio in 1993 when I was 25, and moved just south of Columbus in 1995 when I bought my house, and after over 20 years of seeing the complex there, busy with all kinds of activity, along with a smell that was a lot like a burning clutch or burning brakes, the property is now vacant and void of all the structures. It looks so "wrong". Kind of sad in a way. A lot of history is now gone.
Tod C Dwyer
Lockbourne/Shadeville Ohio
On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 12:54:21 PM EDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:
Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library: https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728 This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit. My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip. Bob Chaparro Hemet, CA
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Regarding in-plant service, I only saw them with casting sand piled into them. It appeared they were used as shuttles to bring the sand from the plant out to huge mounds of the stuff, where they were unloaded with a fascinatingly decrepit clamshell bucket crane.
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Matt Goodman Columbus, Ohio US On May 23, 2020, at 4:56 PM, Steve and Barb Hile <shile@...> wrote: Makes sense to me. I can see a number 10 on the car, also. From what I can see in Eric Neubauer’s builder’s listings. Pressed Steel car built six 55 ton cars (perhaps hoppers?) in 1920. Ralston (also in Columbus) built eighteen 70 ton gondolas for BSCCo in 1920 and 12 more in 1930. Pullman Standard tagged along eight 50 ton, 40’6” seven post gondolas numbered 60-67 to an SP&S order lot 5944, as lot 5944A. Apparently these were all in captive in-plant service as there are not ORER records that I could find (quickly) for Buckeye Steel. Steve Hile From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dave Parker via groups.io Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 2:37 PM To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola Steve: Ahh. Now I get it it. Indeed, the history of the Johnstown facility indicates that it was Cambria when this car was built, then briefly Midvale before the Bethlehem acquisition in 1923. So here's the alternative: The BSCCo stencil refers Buckeye Steel Castings Company, who produced a wide array of steel (earlier iron) castings for the railroad industry. It seems this isn't an interchange car as there is no car number. Perhaps it was built by Cambria for Buckeye to custom specs and/or design. It is a 70-ton car, not something I think of as being very common in 1912. That's the best I can come up with in the SWAG department. Best regards. -- Dave Parker Swall Meadows, CA |
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mark_landgraf
The intellectual property was acquired by Amsted of Chicago. The drawings and microfilm remain in tact and accessible.
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Mark Landgraf
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It’s great to hear the information I was given was incorrect. Thanks, Mark.
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Matt Goodman Columbus, Ohio On May 28, 2020, at 8:26 PM, mark_landgraf via groups.io <mark_landgraf@...> wrote:
The intellectual property was acquired by Amsted of Chicago. The drawings and microfilm remain in tact and accessible. Mark Landgraf Albany NY
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