Tichy wheel car


Tony Thompson
 

Bruce Smith wrote:

If they are new wheelsets, somebody screwed up and didn't protect the axle bearing surfaces ūüėČ

    True, assuming they were otherwise ready for service. But often the machining of the bearing surfaces (and sometimes the wheel tread (to make sure contour was right) would be done somewhere other than the wheel foundry.
    I discussed all this, and showed prototype photos, in my article on trucks and wheels in the _Model Railroad Hobbyist_ issue for September 2016. The scene on my layout, of workmen changing out wheelsets in a truck, has both shiny and rusty wheel treads, but all journal surfaces are shiny. See below.

Tony Thompson




fire5506
 

On Tue, Mar 30, 2021 at 04:14 PM, Tony Thompson wrote:
Bruce Smith wrote:
If they are new wheelsets, somebody screwed up and didn't protect the axle bearing surfaces ūüėČ
    True, assuming they were otherwise ready for service. But often the machining of the bearing surfaces (and sometimes the wheel tread (to make sure contour was right) would be done somewhere other than the wheel foundry.
    I discussed all this, and showed prototype photos, in my article on trucks and wheels in the _Model Railroad Hobbyist_ issue for September 2016. The scene on my layout, of workmen changing out wheelsets in a truck, has both shiny and rusty wheel treads, but all journal surfaces are shiny. See below.

Tony Thompson
 

 I used to work on cars with Babbitt bearing trucks when we still had them. They were a job to replace and also to repack. 

 The journal area of the wheel sets would not be shiny metal until it is clean just prior to installing them. They are coated with a rust inhibitor. We had pans that you put under the journal to catch the mineral spirits used to clean the rust inhibitor off. You also had to look for rust and dings in the journal and use very fine sand paper to remove them.

 The wheels come from the foundry separate from the axles. They are machined to fit the axles at a wheel shop and then pressed on the axles. Back in this groups time span it would be a railroad wheel shop. 
If the wheels were new wheels they would be rusted, if turned then they would have shiny treads until they sat long enough to rust. So on a wheel car coming from a wheel shop might have both rusted tread and shiny treads, but they would be the same on each axle. 
  In the picture you cannot remove an axle with the side frames still on the bolster. The truck has to be completely disassembled. You would also need some kind of crane.
 You pick the bolster up to the top of the side frames, then remove all the springs. Lower the bolster down on to some blocking holding it up so that the top of it is about at the top of the wide spot in the side frame. Then you lift the side frame enough to take the wedge and brass(bearing) out. now you slide the side frame off. Now do the same to the other side frame. Remove the seals. Clean the well out of dirt, oil and water. install new seals. swap out what wheel or wheels are being replaced. reverse the procedure to put it back together. After being put back together install new oiled packing and fill well with journal oil.

Richard Webster


Tony Thompson
 

Richard Webster wrote:

  In the picture you cannot remove an axle with the side frames still on the bolster. The truck has to be completely disassembled. You would also need some kind of crane.

I wouldn't dispute your account, but will just append two photos of the prototype in the 1950s, that I used for modeling. I can supply more if anyone wishes. 

Tony Thompson




Tony Thompson
 

Richard Webster wrote:

  In the picture you cannot remove an axle with the side frames still on the bolster. The truck has to be completely disassembled. You would also need some kind of crane.

In the 1920s and 1930s (the photo below is from May 1930) things were even simpler. This image is from PFE's Nampa Shop, and is one of a long series showing MANY steps in replacing wheel sets. All photos have a single workman, no crane, just a jack for raising the car body

Tony Thompson





Dennis Storzek
 

On Tue, Mar 30, 2021 at 11:36 PM, Tony Thompson wrote:
If you look carefully at the picture, the truck springs have been removed and the sideframes shifted outward to clear the axle ends.

Dennis Storzek


Lester Breuer
 

Tony the truck wheel photos wonderful.  Thanks for sharing.
Lester Breuer


fire5506
 

The top photo the truck is either already back together or it's being taken apart. The bottom photo is a disability waiting to happen with both wheel setout out of the truck and the side frames barely hanging in there. I blew the pictures up to look at them.
Not everyone worked or was allowed to work safely back then.

Richard Webster


fire5506
 

On Wed, Mar 31, 2021 at 02:44 AM, Tony Thompson wrote:
 
In the 1920s and 1930s (the photo below is from May 1930) things were even simpler. This image is from PFE's Nampa Shop, and is one of a long series showing MANY steps in replacing wheel sets. All photos have a single workman, no crane, just a jack for raising the car body
 

 
Unless that one man is superman, he couldn't lift those side frames or wheels by himself let alone line everything up. I will grant you there is no crane, but those wheels are close to 2000 lbs. so there is no way one man will get the old ones off that track and new ones back on it.

Richard Webster


Tony Thompson
 

Richard Webster wrote:

Unless that one man is superman, he couldn't lift those side frames or wheels by himself let alone line everything up. I will grant you there is no crane, but those wheels are close to 2000 lbs. so there is no way one man will get the old ones off that track and new ones back on it.

As experienced riggers and workmen will tell you, when there's no crane, you use the tools the Egyptians built the pyramids with: wedges, levers and rollers. 
     There is a video from the SP wheel shop at Sacramento, with single  men levering wheels up onto their edges and "wheeling" them, by hand, to where they needed to go, no cranes. Included is two men rolling a wheelset off the rails (at a paved crossing) and moving it at 90 degrees to the original direction. Nothing is lifted; sometimes small jacks are used to raise parts,even car bodies.
     Obviously these things were strenuous and many were dangerous. But that IS how it was often done in those days.

Tony Thompson




Ed Mims
 

I can assure you that Richard Webster's description of a wheel change in a railroad shop or car repair track is accurate. You can not remove or apply a solid bearing wheel set without first removing one side frame from its position in the truck bolster to provide space for the axle to be positioned (or removed) in an integral journal box type side frame. Trucks with separable journal boxes, such as Andrews trucks, are much easier. The journal boxes can be removed along with the axle being changed out whiteout disturbing the bolster. The wheel set can be replaced with the journal boxes installed on the axle and the journal boxes re-bolted to the side frames.

All repair track "truck stations" that I am familiar with were equipped with a means to lift the heavy truck parts, i.e. jib cranes or other devices. 

Ed Mims


Ed Mims
 

One more comment: In my experience it was not uncommon for car repair tracks to have a small gasoline powered mobile crane ( about 1-1 1/2 ton capacity)on solid rubber tires to handle heavy material. These were known as a "Go Devil" and were used for such jobs as hanging box car doors, removing and applying couplers, unloading and loading wheels on wheel cars (wheels were often shipped in gondolas as well as on flat cars), adjusting loads shipped on open top cars and for wheel changes when necessary to disassemble the trucks.

Perhaps the "Go Devil" is not shown in the photos presented in earlier correspondence. I'm sure one man cannot do the job of changing wheels assisted  only with jacks, pinch bars, wedges, etc. .

Ed Mims


Tony Thompson
 

Ed Mims wrote:

I can assure you that Richard Webster's description of a wheel change in a railroad shop or car repair track is accurate. You can not remove or apply a solid bearing wheel set without first removing one side frame from its position in the truck bolster to provide space for the axle to be positioned (or removed) in an integral journal box type side frame. Trucks with separable journal boxes, such as Andrews trucks, are much easier. The journal boxes can be removed along with the axle being changed out whiteout disturbing the bolster. The wheel set can be replaced with the journal boxes installed on the axle and the journal boxes re-bolted to the side frames.

     No argument. I just maintain that cranes were by no means always used or available. Small jacks, to support side frames or bolsters, were used in many of the photos I have seen.

Tony Thompson




Tony Thompson
 

   Some have asked, off-list, for a citation of the SP video I mentioned. I don't have a link and don't know if it's on-line or not. But I did write a blog post on the topic of wheel production in SP's shop at Sacramento, and it includes some photos from the SP employee  magazine, _SP Bulletin_, one of which shows a workman rolling a wheel on its edge. That article was in the July 1953 _SP Bulletin_. Here's a link to the blog post if you're interested:


     Railroad car wheels were produced by several commercial companies and sold to railroads. But large railroads (like SP) with their own wheel foundry, assembled those wheels into wheelsets in their own shop, in this case Sacramento.

Tony Thompson




Steve and Barb Hile
 

Of greater interest to me is the Rock Island aluminum express boxcar behind the wheel car.  It has been painted green, but looks quite a lot like it did in 1946.

Steve Hile

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim O'Connor
Sent: Apr 1, 2021 3:44 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Tichy wheel car


Some SP wheels...


On 3/30/2021 9:01 PM, Steve SANDIFER wrote:

These are contemporary photos, but most color ones are newer than this group.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jerry Michels
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2021 1:09 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Tichy wheel car

 

The wheels are probably a little too uniformly rusty, but new wheels can get rusty if they have set around for a while.  If they are new, then the gunk is out.  If they are older sets, perhaps reused by the wreck crew, they could be gunky. Jerry Michels

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Guy Wilber
 

ÔĽŅTony Thompson wrote:

‚ÄúSome have asked, off-list, for a citation of the SP video I mentioned. I don't have a link and don't know if it's on-line or not.‚ÄĚ

This may be the video in question:


Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada 

,_._,_


Tony Thompson
 

Guy Wilber wrote:

This may be the video in question:


Thanks, Guy, an interesting film and one I don’t think I’ve seen. And it includes a nice segment on wheel production. But the one I’m remembering was black and white.
Tony Thompson 


Tim O'Connor
 

Steve

I love the Reynolds Aluminum trademark embossed into the car side! I don't think Sunshine reproduced
that when they offered this car as a resin kit. :-D

Tim O'Connor



On 4/1/2021 5:42 PM, Steve and Barb Hile wrote:
Of greater interest to me is the Rock Island aluminum express boxcar behind the wheel car.  It has been painted green, but looks quite a lot like it did in 1946.

Steve Hile


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


 

Tim,

The embossed TM shows up well in the wheel car photo you posted.

Dan Smith