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Atomic Waste Shipments 1950s

Todd Horton
 



On Sunday, August 21, 2022 at 12:21:41 PM EDT, David Wiggs <bigwiggs@...> wrote:


Anyone have pix of this ACL car?  I suppose it would've been posted already tho if someone had it.

davo in Orlando
David Wiggs
 

Anyone have pix of this ACL car?  I suppose it would've been posted already tho if someone had it.

davo in Orlando
Charles
 

The ATSF way car D933 for the AEC was modified in January 1963, too new a topic for this group. If anyone is interested I can provide Western Archives scans of what appear to be builders photos of the exterior and interior. Contact me off-list.


On Fri, Aug 19, 2022 at 07:28 AM, Charles wrote:
I'll soon be cataloging some photos of one of the ATSF-modified way cars for the Western Archives of the Santa Fe Railway Historical & Modeling Society.

Charley Hepperle

- - -

The Santa Fe modified a couple of drover cabooses for the AEC to serve as guard cars.

One is preserved in Barstow at the Mojave River Valley Museum and another at the S. Calif RR Museum (OERM).

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer
C J Wyatt
 

On Sat, Aug 20, 2022 at 07:00 AM, Larry Goolsby wrote:
I've wondered if ACL cabooses accompanied its shipments in the 666 combine (from the Savannah River Plant, in S. Carolina across the river from the Augusta Ga. area) to Rocky Flats. Bob's Photo has a photo of an ACL red caboose coupled next to a UP caboose at a yard in Colorado - don't have the print in front of me so not sure if it's dated, but I think mid- or late 50s. ACL (and early SCL) kept a couple of wood cabooses around the Augusta area that I suspect were for this service into the early 70s, although they may have been only for local movements on ACL-SCL rather than going cross-country. 

Does anybody have photos of the ACL 666/SCL 4267 in service between Chicago and Colorado?
I doubt that the movement was accompanied by an ACL caboose because the caboose would have to be equipped for passenger train service

If you have a copy of Classic American Streamliners by Mike Schafer and Joe Welsh, take a look at page 119. I believe that is "the Devil's car" on the head of the Hummingbird/Georgian departing southbound at Dearborn Station in Chicago.

One frequent destination was a bomb plant near Burlington IA.

Years ago at a train show, I had a conversation with a member of the BRHS about the car. He had tried to take a photo of it at Chicago Union Station and some guards jumped off the car and chased him away.

Just think, this stuff was being transported right under the public's nose in passenger trains.

Jack Wyatt
Bob Chapman
 

Jim Murrie writes:
In 1961 L&N had four surplus 10-3 sleeping cars modified to baggage dorms or use by Atomic Energy Commission which were renumbered 1650-1653. Only indication of use was "Return to Oak Ridge in small letters.


A bit of truth stranger than fiction -- never one to waste a usable piece of equipment, in 1978 L&N repurposed two of their AEC baggage dorms for snowplow use on their Indiana and Illinois lines. The heavy concrete-lined vault on the cars' interiors was perfect to keep them on the rails while bucking snowdrifts. All four L&N cars survived until 1998. Photo credit -- W Raia, Marion, IN, 9/80, John C LaRue collection.  

Regards,
Bob Chapman

L&N Plow #1650 (Ex-Baggage Dorm), John C LaRue Collection.JPG

Larry Goolsby
 

I've wondered if ACL cabooses accompanied its shipments in the 666 combine (from the Savannah River Plant, in S. Carolina across the river from the Augusta Ga. area) to Rocky Flats. Bob's Photo has a photo of an ACL red caboose coupled next to a UP caboose at a yard in Colorado - don't have the print in front of me so not sure if it's dated, but I think mid- or late 50s. ACL (and early SCL) kept a couple of wood cabooses around the Augusta area that I suspect were for this service into the early 70s, although they may have been only for local movements on ACL-SCL rather than going cross-country. 

Does anybody have photos of the ACL 666/SCL 4267 in service between Chicago and Colorado?
Louie B. Hydrick
 

Greetings,

You can also add the Georgia Railroad, and the Nashville, Chattanooga, & St. Louis Railroads to that list for ACL 666.


Louie B. Hydrick
Associate Broker
RE/MAX Reinvented
130 N. Belair Road
Evans  GA  30809-3261

706-832-6263 Mobile
706-993-1133 Office
706-993-1132 Fax

www.csrahomesandland.com
Kenneth Montero
 

NKP has a model kit for an ACCL-SCL car used in such service:

ACL Class E10 Heavyweight Combine
This car carried Atomic Energy Commission material in the 50's & 60's from Georgia to Iowa and Colorado.  This car ran on the ACL, NYC&StL, L&N, C&EI (Sometimes PRR via Cincinnati) and transferred to the CB&Q at Chicago.  Kit features etched brass sides with separate window sashes and doors.  Also includes styrene roof, ends, centersill and floor; plus resin custom-cast steam ejector A/C, large battery boxes, oversize water tank and many other unique detail underbody and roof parts.  The Commonwealth top equalized roller bearing 6-wheel trucks are included.		 ACL #666
SCL #4267

Ken Montero



On 08/18/2022 5:34 PM Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



And the 9792 is now at the Illinois Railway Museum :-)

On 8/18/2022 5:13 PM, Jeffrey White wrote:

In 1956 the IC modified two cabooses 9791 and 9792 for the AEC in their Centralia shops.  They were returned to the railroad and the modifications removed in 1960 and the cabooses were placed back into service.

I have no other information on what the modifications were.

Jeff White

Alma IL



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Scott
 

That must be a special move up to Rocky Flats on the Rio Grande as they have the L & N car coupled to a steam generator car.  Be an interesting car to add for Rio Grande modelers.

Scott McDonald 
Steve Stull
 

A mistake in my memories.  Jumbo was placed 800 yards from Ground Zero.

Sorry about that.

Steve Stull
winslow7076

On Friday, August 19, 2022 at 06:15:23 AM AKDT, Steve Stull via groups.io <winslow7076@...> wrote:


Tim;

The load on CISX 500 is known as Jumbo, a planned containment vessel in case the prototype Fat Man bomb was a fizzle or a complete dud.  It ended up not being used, because they couldn't figure out how to get intrumentation on it in case the bomb DID work.  I believe it was set up approx 200 feet from ground zero at the Trinity site in White Sands NM.  It survived the blast, but was empty during transport and the test.

Steve Stull
winslow7076

On Friday, August 19, 2022 at 05:26:53 AM AKDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


Bruce

Are you certain of that? Enrichment facilities at Hanford and Oak Ridge certainly produced
nuclear bomb materials, and it had to be moved to wherever warheads were being constructed.

These cannisters (photo) likely had something hazardous in them, although I don't know what it was.

And of course this famous photo (CISX 500) of stuff moved to Los Alamos.


On 8/19/2022 9:17 AM, Bruce Smith wrote:
Philip,
Hahahahahaha! No. They transported fuel, and bomb components. 
It was a different era and today's safety rules were not in effect.
Regards,
Bruce


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Charles
 

I'll soon be cataloging some photos of one of the ATSF-modified way cars for the Western Archives of the Santa Fe Railway Historical & Modeling Society.

Charley Hepperle

- - -

The Santa Fe modified a couple of drover cabooses for the AEC to serve as guard cars.

One is preserved in Barstow at the Mojave River Valley Museum and another at the S. Calif RR Museum (OERM).

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer
Steve Stull
 

Tim;

The load on CISX 500 is known as Jumbo, a planned containment vessel in case the prototype Fat Man bomb was a fizzle or a complete dud.  It ended up not being used, because they couldn't figure out how to get intrumentation on it in case the bomb DID work.  I believe it was set up approx 200 feet from ground zero at the Trinity site in White Sands NM.  It survived the blast, but was empty during transport and the test.

Steve Stull
winslow7076

On Friday, August 19, 2022 at 05:26:53 AM AKDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


Bruce

Are you certain of that? Enrichment facilities at Hanford and Oak Ridge certainly produced
nuclear bomb materials, and it had to be moved to wherever warheads were being constructed.

These cannisters (photo) likely had something hazardous in them, although I don't know what it was.

And of course this famous photo (CISX 500) of stuff moved to Los Alamos.


On 8/19/2022 9:17 AM, Bruce Smith wrote:
Philip,
Hahahahahaha! No. They transported fuel, and bomb components. 
It was a different era and today's safety rules were not in effect.
Regards,
Bruce


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Tim O'Connor
 

Bruce

Are you certain of that? Enrichment facilities at Hanford and Oak Ridge certainly produced
nuclear bomb materials, and it had to be moved to wherever warheads were being constructed.

These cannisters (photo) likely had something hazardous in them, although I don't know what it was.

And of course this famous photo (CISX 500) of stuff moved to Los Alamos.


On 8/19/2022 9:17 AM, Bruce Smith wrote:

Philip,
Hahahahahaha! No. They transported fuel, and bomb components. 
It was a different era and today's safety rules were not in effect.
Regards,
Bruce


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

sp_ freight-train-242 t&no_ caboose 85ft_flats G85 TOFC Clejan-style flatbed-trailers cannister-loads LaCosteX 1960.RogerPuta.jpg

cisx_500 depressed center flat nuclear fuel cannister.jpg

Bruce Smith
 

Philip,

Hahahahahaha! No. They transported fuel, and bomb components. 

It was a different era and today's safety rules were not in effect.

Regards,
Bruce

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Philip Dove <philipdove22@...>
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2022 2:32 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: [EXT] Re: [RealSTMFC] Atomic Waste Shipments 1950s
 
CAUTION: Email Originated Outside of Auburn.
Nuclear waste is not always spent fuel and highly radioactive materials. Paper towels and everyday garbage from Xray suites in hospitals is also nuclear waste but described as low level nuclear waste.  It gets transported to waste facilities. I would hope this was all the ex baggage cars were transporting. 
Philip Dove
 

Nuclear waste is not always spent fuel and highly radioactive materials. Paper towels and everyday garbage from Xray suites in hospitals is also nuclear waste but described as low level nuclear waste.  It gets transported to waste facilities. I would hope this was all the ex baggage cars were transporting. 
Jim and Barbara van Gaasbeek
 

Nuclear fuel is transferred to the reprocessing plant in England in special trains, with two cars containing the fuel, with an engine top-and-tailing the train.

 

The Us has a very large, brand-new nuclear storage facility in Nevada (Yucca Mountain, Yucca Mountain nuclear waste repository - Wikipedia) that is not in use, owing to states refusing to allow the material to be transported through their states.  But that gets us into politics, so I’ll stop.

 

 

Jim van Gaasbeek

Irvine, California

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Steve SANDIFER
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2022 3:08 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Atomic Waste Shipments 1950s

 

The Santa Fe modified a couple of drover cabooses for the AEC to serve as guard cars.

One is preserved in Barstow at the Mojave River Valley Museum and another at the S. Calif RR Museum (OERM).

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2022 4:34 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Atomic Waste Shipments 1950s

 


And the 9792 is now at the Illinois Railway Museum :-)

On 8/18/2022 5:13 PM, Jeffrey White wrote:

In 1956 the IC modified two cabooses 9791 and 9792 for the AEC in their Centralia shops.  They were returned to the railroad and the modifications removed in 1960 and the cabooses were placed back into service.

I have no other information on what the modifications were.

Jeff White

Alma IL

 


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Steve SANDIFER
 

The Santa Fe modified a couple of drover cabooses for the AEC to serve as guard cars.

One is preserved in Barstow at the Mojave River Valley Museum and another at the S. Calif RR Museum (OERM).

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2022 4:34 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Atomic Waste Shipments 1950s

 


And the 9792 is now at the Illinois Railway Museum :-)

On 8/18/2022 5:13 PM, Jeffrey White wrote:

In 1956 the IC modified two cabooses 9791 and 9792 for the AEC in their Centralia shops.  They were returned to the railroad and the modifications removed in 1960 and the cabooses were placed back into service.

I have no other information on what the modifications were.

Jeff White

Alma IL

 


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Tim O'Connor
 


And the 9792 is now at the Illinois Railway Museum :-)

On 8/18/2022 5:13 PM, Jeffrey White wrote:

In 1956 the IC modified two cabooses 9791 and 9792 for the AEC in their Centralia shops.  They were returned to the railroad and the modifications removed in 1960 and the cabooses were placed back into service.

I have no other information on what the modifications were.

Jeff White

Alma IL



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

ic_9792 side-door caboose museum IRM 2004.jpg

Jeffrey White
 

In 1956 the IC modified two cabooses 9791 and 9792 for the AEC in their Centralia shops.  They were returned to the railroad and the modifications removed in 1960 and the cabooses were placed back into service.

I have no other information on what the modifications were.

Jeff White

Alma IL

On 8/18/2022 4:00 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:


Thanks Jim ! I misremembered the car - it was L&N, not ACL.

On 8/18/2022 12:40 PM, james murrie via groups.io wrote:
There were several cars, basically modified baggage cars, used by several railroads. They ran in regularly scheduled passenger trains.  For example MILW 1046 (if I remember correctly) was a 70ft heavyweight express car that ran weekly between Oak Ridge TN to Hanford WA with radioactive material. Normally ran in "The Columbian", Tr. 17/18 from Chicago and cut out to go down the branch line to Hanford reservation. 

In 1961 L&N had four surplus 10-3 sleeping cars modified to baggage dorms or use by Atomic Energy Commission which were renumbered 1650-1653. Only indication of use was "Return to Oak Ridge in small letters.

And there was also SCL 666 which ran Savannah to Rocky Flats CO.

Jim Murrie

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Tim O'Connor
 


Thanks Jim ! I misremembered the car - it was L&N, not ACL.

On 8/18/2022 12:40 PM, james murrie via groups.io wrote:

There were several cars, basically modified baggage cars, used by several railroads. They ran in regularly scheduled passenger trains.  For example MILW 1046 (if I remember correctly) was a 70ft heavyweight express car that ran weekly between Oak Ridge TN to Hanford WA with radioactive material. Normally ran in "The Columbian", Tr. 17/18 from Chicago and cut out to go down the branch line to Hanford reservation. 

In 1961 L&N had four surplus 10-3 sleeping cars modified to baggage dorms or use by Atomic Energy Commission which were renumbered 1650-1653. Only indication of use was "Return to Oak Ridge in small letters.

And there was also SCL 666 which ran Savannah to Rocky Flats CO.

Jim Murrie

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

l&n_1651 hw baggage-dorm rebuild DenverCO 1963.jpg

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