Freight Commodity Statistics
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I recently came across the attached Freight Commodity Statistics from a 1952 C&O annual report. It dawned on my that this data along with an ORER from the year I am modeling will help me to curate a properly balanced freight car fleet for my layout. I do have a few questions that the wise folk in the group might be able to answer. How was grain shipped in the early 50's? The C&O didn't have a large fleet of covered hoppers and what they did have seemed to be used more for things like cement. I am guessing that boxcars would have been used. I have read items that have mentioned grain doors. Can someone explain to me what grain doors would have looked like and how were they used? I also see that chemicals and explosives is a significant category. I would assume that when they speak of chemicals, these would mostly be tank car commodities, but what about the explosives? I am assuming that much of this would be used in the mines and would be delivered by box car. How were these cars marked. I would assume some kind of a placard but I am not finding much that indicates what style would be correct for the early 50's. |
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mark_landgraf
Dave,
Grain would have likely showed up in cars from roads west of thee C&O's territory. The buffalo Creek RR had a large fleet of 40 ft grain box cars. That might be a good source of reference. Typically on the inside of the doorway were nailed in place horizontal planks, up to about 4-5 ft high. Cardboard was attached to the inside of the planks and folded flat down onto the floor. The flour was side loaded via large hoses placed above the side planks. Unloading typically required the removal of some of the planks. Some places could pick up the car and tip it to help unload it, while others just shoveled it out. Later the planking was replaced with sheets of steel banding reinforced cardboard. Chemicals could have been in smaller gallonage tank cars. Chemicals are usually heavier than water. Alternately they could have been 55 gallon drums in box cars. Explosives were probably either for mining purposes or for military consumption. Dynamite was usually shipped in wooden crates or later in waxed cardboard boxes. Both likely shipped in boxcars. But think about howlarge a mine would need to be to go through a boxcars worth. If you're seeing large numbers, it was probably military.. The railroad hauled it and it and those tons counted, but the traffic may have originated or terminate as off line traffic. The remainder would have been home road traffic Mark Landgraf Albany NY
On Friday, February 10, 2023, 11:39:03 AM EST, Dave Wetterstroem <framemakers@...> wrote:
I recently came across the attached Freight Commodity Statistics from a 1952 C&O annual report. It dawned on my that this data along with an ORER from the year I am modeling will help me to curate a properly balanced freight car fleet for my layout. I do have a few questions that the wise folk in the group might be able to answer. How was grain shipped in the early 50's? The C&O didn't have a large fleet of covered hoppers and what they did have seemed to be used more for things like cement. I am guessing that boxcars would have been used. I have read items that have mentioned grain doors. Can someone explain to me what grain doors would have looked like and how were they used? I also see that chemicals and explosives is a significant category. I would assume that when they speak of chemicals, these would mostly be tank car commodities, but what about the explosives? I am assuming that much of this would be used in the mines and would be delivered by box car. How were these cars marked. I would assume some kind of a placard but I am not finding much that indicates what style would be correct for the early 50's. |
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I found this. I will be sure to have a few cars with this placard on the layout. Notice the special instructions, adding something like this to your operating sessions will keep your crews on their toes. We wouldn't want to have something go BOOM on our layout. |
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On Fri, Feb 10, 2023 at 12:06 PM, mark_landgraf wrote:
The list breaks out grain that originated on the C&O as well as from connecting railroads. In 1952, 1,112,084 tons originated on the C&O and 792,268 tons was received from other roads. |
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Bill Parks
Old annual reports for whichever railroad you are interested in are a great source for information like this. Best place to look for them is on EBay.
-- Bill Parks Cumming, GA Modelling the Seaboard Airline in Central Florida |
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Dave Nelson
I’ve been using this data for decades. I’ve attached a spreadsheet for the Western Pacific in 1948. I merged the ICC data with some seasonality data from the AAR to make some assumptions about what might have been occurring on the WP.
Much harder to find are the quarterly reports of the same data.
FWIW, yours is an abbreviated list; after 1947 there were something on the order of 265 commodity classes.
Several of these reports are available on Google Books, including a couple in the 1950’s. IIRC there is also a business directory from 1950 for West Virginia there.
Dave Nelson From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Dave Wetterstroem
I recently came across the attached Freight Commodity Statistics from a 1952 C&O annual report. It dawned on my that this data along with an ORER from the year I am modeling will help me to curate a properly balanced freight car fleet for my layout. I do have a few questions that the wise folk in the group might be able to answer. How was grain shipped in the early 50's? The C&O didn't have a large fleet of covered hoppers and what they did have seemed to be used more for things like cement. I am guessing that boxcars would have been used. I have read items that have mentioned grain doors. Can someone explain to me what grain doors would have looked like and how were they used? I also see that chemicals and explosives is a significant category. I would assume that when they speak of chemicals, these would mostly be tank car commodities, but what about the explosives? I am assuming that much of this would be used in the mines and would be delivered by box car. How were these cars marked. I would assume some kind of a placard but I am not finding much that indicates what style would be correct for the early 50's. |
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Dave Nelson, Interesting that on both railroads, Gravel and Sand are such major commodities. Someone suggested that it might be from all the highway construction, but the Federal Highway Act wasn't till 1956. |
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akerboomk
The ICC reports are probably available in most "major city" libraries (Buffalo, NY had them)
There's more info and the actual titles to search with here: http://bmfreightcars.com/ICC_Freight_Statistics.html Note the ICC statistics don't have $ values -- Ken Akerboom http://bmfreightcars.com/ |
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Dave Nelson
In the case of California gravel was a very uncommon commodity, at least in the north half of the state. By far the largest deposit was in Livermore (owned by Henry J. Kaiser) and both the WP and SP hauled it’s gravel to the cities along the Bayshore as well as over Altamont Pass to the interior valley.
In the years before WWII it was very common for rural roads on the west coat to only be gravel. Henry Kaiser started his industrial empire building such roads up and down the west coast. His understanding of work break down structure served him quite well later on when helping the Bechtels build large dams. In WWII he took a bet regarding how fast a Liberty Ship could be built. With clever planning they built and launched one in 4 days His methods produced Liberty Ships at just 25% the cost of other shipyards. His 8 shipyards on the west coast were a major destination for steel in WWII.
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Dave Wetterstroem
Dave Nelson, Interesting that on both railroads, Gravel and Sand are such major commodities. Someone suggested that it might be from all the highway construction, but the Federal Highway Act wasn't till 1956. |
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Dave Parker
On Fri, Feb 10, 2023 at 02:48 PM, akerboomk wrote:
The ICC reports are probably available in most "major city" libraries (Buffalo, NY had them)Hathi Trust has them from 1924 to beyond the limits of this list. I think Google Books has a comparable collection, just not as tidy in terms of a bibliographic summary. Try searching thee with: "Freight Commodity Statistics, Class I Railroads in the United States" followed by a 4-digit year. A tremendous resource (=rabbit-hole), especially because there are regional and national summaries to which the individual road data can be compared. -- Dave Parker Swall Meadows, CA |
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John Mateyko <rattler21@...>
  Weaver XF boxcar modified for bulk grain service.    |
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Aley, Jeff A
One thing you probably need to realize is that these commodity classes were established by the ICC, and not by the C&O. Therefore, even though the category is named “chemicals and explosives”, it does not necessarily mean that there was any significant shipment of explosives on the C&O. Of course there was SOME, but it could have been relatively rare – most of the tonnage might have been just plain chemicals.
Regards,
-Jeff
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Dave Wetterstroem
Sent: Friday, February 10, 2023 8:38 AM To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io Subject: [RealSTMFC] Freight Commodity Statistics
I recently came across the attached Freight Commodity Statistics from a 1952 C&O annual report. It dawned on my that this data along with an ORER from the year I am modeling will help me to curate a properly balanced freight car fleet for my layout. I do have a few questions that the wise folk in the group might be able to answer. How was grain shipped in the early 50's? The C&O didn't have a large fleet of covered hoppers and what they did have seemed to be used more for things like cement. I am guessing that boxcars would have been used. I have read items that have mentioned grain doors. Can someone explain to me what grain doors would have looked like and how were they used? I also see that chemicals and explosives is a significant category. I would assume that when they speak of chemicals, these would mostly be tank car commodities, but what about the explosives? I am assuming that much of this would be used in the mines and would be delivered by box car. How were these cars marked. I would assume some kind of a placard but I am not finding much that indicates what style would be correct for the early 50's. |
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Jeff, That being said, I really love the idea of having a box car or two with an explosives placard on it. |
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Tom Madden
On Sat, Feb 11, 2023 at 11:57 AM, Dave Wetterstroem wrote:
Back in the 1950s MR published a photo of an exploding boxcar with "Pelligro Dinimita" stenciled on the sides. The interior contained a pinball ball sitting on a short piece of concave track. If the car wasn't switched with extreme care the ball would roll off the end of the track, completing a circuit that triggered a mechanism that caused the sides and roof to pop off. It might have been John Allen. Tom Madden |
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Scott H. Haycock
Definitely John Allen. IIRC, He would put the car in the trains of visitors who may be a little too heavy-handed on the throttle. His engines ran better than most of that era.
Scott Haycock
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On Fri, Feb 10, 2023 at 03:04 PM, Dave Parker wrote:
Try searching thee with:On my phone, this link came up in that search - for Northwest modelers, a report from the Ninth Federal Reserve District office in Minneapolis for June of 1928: https://www.minneapolisfed.org/~/media/files/research/monthly/1928/2806a.pdf?la=en It includes annual carloadings from the district as well as some monthly datas. I don't know if this was a standard publication of all Federal Reserve Districts or not, but it could be useful, if it was. Dave Smith |
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B.L. Griffith
Per Tony Thompson’s wonderful series of books on Southern Pacific freight cars; 20 or so of the SP express boxcar (passenger service) fleet of 50 were modified with GSC outside swing hanger trucks. Because the cars so equipped rode so well was the reason stated for them to be given a second life assigned specifically to ammunition service in the 1960s. If the C&O had any military bases or munitions/explosives manufacturing online, it’s entirely possible they, like the SP, had boxcars dedicated or modified specifically for that service. |
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This might be one of those cars -- at Alamogordo NM, no less. On 2/11/2023 5:07 PM, B.L. Griffith wrote:
--
Tim O'Connor Sterling, Massachusetts |
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David Soderblom
But the C&O was all about coal, and mining is all about explosives. I would think mines received explosive shipments on a regular basis.
Sent from my tricorder |
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I built this car for an old train club and placarded it for explosives for delivery to the two mines on the layout. The club was based on the C&O in West Virginia and Virginia. Richard Hendrickson supplied the art and information for the Microscale set that includes this decal. On 2/11/2023 6:00 PM, David Soderblom wrote: But the C&O was all about coal, and mining is all about explosives. I would think mines received explosive shipments on a regular basis. --
Tim O'Connor Sterling, Massachusetts |
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