Alaska Railroad Hart Convertible Ballast Gondola ARR 1443


Richard Wilkens
 

Alaska Railroad Hart convertible ballast gondola ARR 1443 built by Pacific Car & Foundry in May 1930. Pacific Northwest Railroad Archive Collection.

Richard Wilkens


Lloyd Keyser
 

Sure wish someone  would do the Hart cars in 3D. It should be a good seller as most railroads had them and were also used in cinder service. LK

On Mon, Jul 18, 2022 at 12:26 PM Richard Wilkens <railsnw123@...> wrote:
Alaska Railroad Hart convertible ballast gondola ARR 1443 built by Pacific Car & Foundry in May 1930. Pacific Northwest Railroad Archive Collection.

Richard Wilkens


Eric Hansmann
 

Which Hart convertible gondola design? I believe there were several options down through the decades. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

On Jul 18, 2022, at 2:29 PM, Lloyd Keyser <lloydkeyser@...> wrote:

Sure wish someone  would do the Hart cars in 3D. It should be a good seller as most railroads had them and were also used in cinder service. LK


Lloyd Keyser
 


Branch Line did the car in their Blueprint series. One in the yellow and green and the other in the grey scheme.
I assembled four each and they do take a little work besides changing to AB brakes. The biggest problem I  had and took the longest time to correct was the sides of my cars were thicker than the side inset. In other words when you looked at the end of the car you saw two yellow stripes down each side. I thinned my sides down to match the depth of the side to get rid of the yellow. The lettering on the grey cars was acceptable but the Y/G sides had the wrong color of green which did not fully cover and did not match the darker ends and the lettering was not good. I stripped the sides, repainted and redecaled with Westerfield decals. I do not know  if these problems were corrected in later runs or not. LK

On Mon, Jul 18, 2022 at 1:47 PM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:
Which Hart convertible gondola design? I believe there were several options down through the decades. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

On Jul 18, 2022, at 2:29 PM, Lloyd Keyser <lloydkeyser@...> wrote:

Sure wish someone  would do the Hart cars in 3D. It should be a good seller as most railroads had them and were also used in cinder service. LK


Tony Thompson
 

Lloyd Keyser wrote:

Sure wish someone  would do the Hart cars in 3D. It should be a good seller as most railroads had them and were also used in cinder service. 

Lloyd, you must not be aware of Dry Creek models. See my blog post:


Tony Thompson


Lloyd Keyser
 

I put the Branchline car info in the wrong place. Sorry about that. The Hart car I'm referring to is the Alaska car. I believe the 1937 Car Builders may have had the plans. My 1940 does not. C&NW were still using them in the late fifties as cinder cars. I just found a copy of page 310 showing three pictures of the car but not  what it came out of. I'm hoping some on the list can fill this in. Built by Rodger Ballast Car Company. Best LK

On Mon, Jul 18, 2022 at 2:05 PM Lloyd Keyser <lloydkeyser@...> wrote:

Branch Line did the car in their Blueprint series. One in the yellow and green and the other in the grey scheme.
I assembled four each and they do take a little work besides changing to AB brakes. The biggest problem I  had and took the longest time to correct was the sides of my cars were thicker than the side inset. In other words when you looked at the end of the car you saw two yellow stripes down each side. I thinned my sides down to match the depth of the side to get rid of the yellow. The lettering on the grey cars was acceptable but the Y/G sides had the wrong color of green which did not fully cover and did not match the darker ends and the lettering was not good. I stripped the sides, repainted and redecaled with Westerfield decals. I do not know  if these problems were corrected in later runs or not. LK

On Mon, Jul 18, 2022 at 1:47 PM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:
Which Hart convertible gondola design? I believe there were several options down through the decades. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

On Jul 18, 2022, at 2:29 PM, Lloyd Keyser <lloydkeyser@...> wrote:

Sure wish someone  would do the Hart cars in 3D. It should be a good seller as most railroads had them and were also used in cinder service. LK


Lloyd Keyser
 

Thanks Tony I was not aware of these cars being available. Is this outfit still in business? I would like two of the Kit 101 which his site shows as sold out. Do you know if he has rerun these or is willing to rerun? Will he be at RPM?Best LK

On Mon, Jul 18, 2022 at 2:30 PM Lloyd Keyser via groups.io <lloydkeyser=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
I put the Branchline car info in the wrong place. Sorry about that. The Hart car I'm referring to is the Alaska car. I believe the 1937 Car Builders may have had the plans. My 1940 does not. C&NW were still using them in the late fifties as cinder cars. I just found a copy of page 310 showing three pictures of the car but not  what it came out of. I'm hoping some on the list can fill this in. Built by Rodger Ballast Car Company. Best LK

On Mon, Jul 18, 2022 at 2:05 PM Lloyd Keyser <lloydkeyser@...> wrote:

Branch Line did the car in their Blueprint series. One in the yellow and green and the other in the grey scheme.
I assembled four each and they do take a little work besides changing to AB brakes. The biggest problem I  had and took the longest time to correct was the sides of my cars were thicker than the side inset. In other words when you looked at the end of the car you saw two yellow stripes down each side. I thinned my sides down to match the depth of the side to get rid of the yellow. The lettering on the grey cars was acceptable but the Y/G sides had the wrong color of green which did not fully cover and did not match the darker ends and the lettering was not good. I stripped the sides, repainted and redecaled with Westerfield decals. I do not know  if these problems were corrected in later runs or not. LK

On Mon, Jul 18, 2022 at 1:47 PM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:
Which Hart convertible gondola design? I believe there were several options down through the decades. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

On Jul 18, 2022, at 2:29 PM, Lloyd Keyser <lloydkeyser@...> wrote:

Sure wish someone  would do the Hart cars in 3D. It should be a good seller as most railroads had them and were also used in cinder service. LK


Kenneth Montero
 

Walthers, in the Silver Streak line, made a Hart convertible gondola. I don't know how close it came to the prototype that you are trying to model. That kit does show up periodically on Ebay (including now) and elsewhere.

Ken Montero


On 07/18/2022 2:47 PM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:


Which Hart convertible gondola design? I believe there were several options down through the decades. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

On Jul 18, 2022, at 2:29 PM, Lloyd Keyser <lloydkeyser@...> wrote:

Sure wish someone  would do the Hart cars in 3D. It should be a good seller as most railroads had them and were also used in cinder service. LK


Lloyd Keyser
 

Thanks Ken, the Silver Streak car is not as detailed as I would like. The SP car that Tony talked about is a very nice car but not quite like the CNW cars that had higher sides and the end side panels were different with grab irons. I was referring to the Alaska car. The SP cars would be a good stand in. LK

On Mon, Jul 18, 2022 at 9:52 PM Kenneth Montero <va661midlo@...> wrote:
Walthers, in the Silver Streak line, made a Hart convertible gondola. I don't know how close it came to the prototype that you are trying to model. That kit does show up periodically on Ebay (including now) and elsewhere.

Ken Montero


On 07/18/2022 2:47 PM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:


Which Hart convertible gondola design? I believe there were several options down through the decades. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

On Jul 18, 2022, at 2:29 PM, Lloyd Keyser <lloydkeyser@...> wrote:

Sure wish someone  would do the Hart cars in 3D. It should be a good seller as most railroads had them and were also used in cinder service. LK


Robert Bowdidge
 

I made the 3d-printed SP Hart gondolas.  I don't have any of the "as-built" models left, but still have a few "modernized" cars with the side dump doors removed.  I'm not planning on making additional cars any time soon due to time pressure from the day job.

As others pointed out, the Hart gondolas came in a range of sizes and shapes depending on the era they were made, the railroad who ordered them, and perhaps the car builder who actually built them.  Like other wood cars, they also got a lot of abuse and so likely got rebuilt in interesting and diverse ways.  The SP W-50-3 cars were built in 1911; they were 40' long inside with 3' high side walls and wood side posts.  These match the dimensions of the original Alaska Railroad 1400 series cars built in 1918:

https://www.alaskarails.org/pix2/gone-cars/eng_drwgs/hart-convertible-1400.jpg

They're definitely not the same as the 1930-built ARR 1443 from Williams's photos which used a lot more steel and had different door arrangements.

If anyone's got a photo of the original ARR cars, I'd be curious how they compare to the SP cars.

Robert Bowdidge

rbowdidge@...


Richard Wilkens
 

Unfortunately no side views but these are noted as being of car No. 1401 built for the Alaska Engineering Commission by Seattle Car & Foundry.

Richard Wilkens