ATSF reefer colors


Andy Carlson
 

An interesting view of the differences in "Yellow/Orange"
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA



Inline image


Nelson Moyer
 

Thanks for that photo, Andy. It supports the ‘anything goes’ argument. I color samples a number of prototype and model SFRD reefers and attached the RGB codes and color dots. They pretty much cover the spectrum from yellow to orange. I still haven’t decided which four to use on my reefers.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Andy Carlson
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2022 10:30 AM
To: STMFC <realstmfc@groups.io>
Subject: [RealSTMFC] ATSF reefer colors

 

An interesting view of the differences in "Yellow/Orange"

-Andy Carlson

Ojai CA

 

 

 

Inline image


Robert kirkham
 

I think the colour sampling is a useful step.  I’ve done something similar - other side of the coin - with various paint colours sold by Vallejo, AK, Mig, etc, with an eye to figuring how to mix what i see in photos.      

A couple of things i’m trying to think about but don’t have a handle on:

Scale colour - the effect of bringing paint indoors, under layout lighting - and how to choose model paint colours that resemble the appearance of the prototype cars. 

But also, something more about the scene itself:  I wonder how to make colour selections - within a realistic range - that take into account the colour of the scenery i model and the layout lighting.   I ask because our perception of colour is affected by the adjacent colours.  I’m thinking backdrop, ballast, static grass, line-side structures, etc.  I don’t have a mental algorithm that says “my scenery is more in the mountains with blues, grays and greens, so it makes sense to choose car colours that  . . . ; another modeller might say their scenery is more “desert yellows and browns so it makes sense for the freight cars to look . . . “, or “My scenery is urban, with brick red and concrete dominant, so it makes sense for rolling stock to look . . . “  But i think there may be something in that kind of thinking.

So far, experimenting seems a slow process.

rob



On Jul 2, 2022, at 9:59 AM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

Thanks for that photo, Andy. It supports the ‘anything goes’ argument. I color samples a number of prototype and model SFRD reefers and attached the RGB codes and color dots. They pretty much cover the spectrum from yellow to orange. I still haven’t decided which four to use on my reefers.
 
Nelson Moyer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Andy Carlson
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2022 10:30 AM
To: STMFC <realstmfc@groups.io>
Subject: [RealSTMFC] ATSF reefer colors
 
An interesting view of the differences in "Yellow/Orange"
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA
 
 
 

<image001.png>

<SFRD Color Matching Paint Chips.docx>


Todd Sullivan
 

Just to add to the discussion, with my last layout, I tried using stock fluorescent bulbs to illuminate the layout room, using twin tube fixtures.  The light emitted gave everything a greenish look.  Not what I was after!  So, I tried some daylight (5000K) bulbs, and everything looked blue and none of the warmer colors (like rusty stuff) showed well.  So, I bought some 3500K warm bulbs and tried them.  Only the warm colors showed well, and I lost all the blues and blacks.  So, I installed one 3500K bulb with a 5000K bulb in the same fixture, and voila!  Close to the full spectrum of colors.

I now live in Texas, and was concerned about adding heat to my layout room (which is on he second floor - no basements here), and I wanted to duplicate the same style of lighting without the heat-producing fluorescents.  I found some 33500K and 5000K strip LED lights on Amazon, but had to devise a way of installing the strips side-by-side on moldings attached to the ceiling.  They work well, but I wish they provided a bit more light.

So, that's another factor in how you choose to color things on your layout.  PS, I try to paint and weather all my structures and rolling stock under the same lighting conditions as the layout room.

Todd Sullivan


Tony Thompson
 

Andy Carlson  wrote:

An interesting view of the differences in "Yellow/Orange"

I don’t think it’s been mentioned yet, but both the PFE and SFRD orange faded toward yellow. There are lots of examples out there.

Tony Thompson




Scott Kremer
 

In addition to the Kelvin rating there is also a CRI, Color Rendition Index, which gives you an idea of the accuracy of the color in question.  CRI’s for bulbs with a value of 90 or less will almost always result in a green cast to the light.  Today finding LED’s, bulbs not tubes,  with a CRI of 90 or higher is expensive.  In most cases a price of $14 to $18 per bulb for a 100 watt equivalent bulb.  That will change and there are some wattages and Kelvin temps with a price of less than $5 per bulb.  Still expensive.  I have not researched tubes but the same criteria applies.  Check out sources on the internet or, if you are lucky, check with your local lighting specialist store.

Scott Kremer

On Jul 2, 2022, at 1:54 PM, Todd Sullivan via groups.io <sullivant41@...> wrote:

Just to add to the discussion, with my last layout, I tried using stock fluorescent bulbs to illuminate the layout room, using twin tube fixtures.  The light emitted gave everything a greenish look.  Not what I was after!  So, I tried some daylight (5000K) bulbs, and everything looked blue and none of the warmer colors (like rusty stuff) showed well.  So, I bought some 3500K warm bulbs and tried them.  Only the warm colors showed well, and I lost all the blues and blacks.  So, I installed one 3500K bulb with a 5000K bulb in the same fixture, and voila!  Close to the full spectrum of colors.

I now live in Texas, and was concerned about adding heat to my layout room (which is on he second floor - no basements here), and I wanted to duplicate the same style of lighting without the heat-producing fluorescents.  I found some 33500K and 5000K strip LED lights on Amazon, but had to devise a way of installing the strips side-by-side on moldings attached to the ceiling.  They work well, but I wish they provided a bit more light.

So, that's another factor in how you choose to color things on your layout.  PS, I try to paint and weather all my structures and rolling stock under the same lighting conditions as the layout room.

Todd Sullivan


Nelson Moyer
 

I researches fluorescent tubes in 2013, looking for 5000 K and a high CRI. I attached a table of the results. Regrettably, the inexpensive tubes are disappearing, and I can no longer find them locally. I’ve decided to switch to LED tubes as the fluorescent tubes fail.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Scott Kremer
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2022 1:36 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] ATSF reefer colors

 

In addition to the Kelvin rating there is also a CRI, Color Rendition Index, which gives you an idea of the accuracy of the color in question.  CRI’s for bulbs with a value of 90 or less will almost always result in a green cast to the light.  Today finding LED’s, bulbs not tubes,  with a CRI of 90 or higher is expensive.  In most cases a price of $14 to $18 per bulb for a 100 watt equivalent bulb.  That will change and there are some wattages and Kelvin temps with a price of less than $5 per bulb.  Still expensive.  I have not researched tubes but the same criteria applies.  Check out sources on the internet or, if you are lucky, check with your local lighting specialist store.

 

Scott Kremer

 


Steve SANDIFER
 

I used 5000K LED tubed with single end electrical connection. I got them from 1000bulb.com, 25 for $100.  Put pigtails on that one end and you have lightsabers which are useful for not only layout lighting but under layout troubleshooting.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nelson Moyer
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2022 2:33 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] ATSF reefer colors

 

I researches fluorescent tubes in 2013, looking for 5000 K and a high CRI. I attached a table of the results. Regrettably, the inexpensive tubes are disappearing, and I can no longer find them locally. I’ve decided to switch to LED tubes as the fluorescent tubes fail.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Scott Kremer
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2022 1:36 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] ATSF reefer colors

 

In addition to the Kelvin rating there is also a CRI, Color Rendition Index, which gives you an idea of the accuracy of the color in question.  CRI’s for bulbs with a value of 90 or less will almost always result in a green cast to the light.  Today finding LED’s, bulbs not tubes,  with a CRI of 90 or higher is expensive.  In most cases a price of $14 to $18 per bulb for a 100 watt equivalent bulb.  That will change and there are some wattages and Kelvin temps with a price of less than $5 per bulb.  Still expensive.  I have not researched tubes but the same criteria applies.  Check out sources on the internet or, if you are lucky, check with your local lighting specialist store.

 

Scott Kremer

 


Gary Ray
 

When I had to tear apart my layout to move to TX, I had over 240 CRI90+ bulbs that had replaced all my CFL's.  They were 60 watt equivalent.  In a yard sale, I had a hard time finding someone to give me $20 for all of them.  Guess I should have sold them on the internet.

New layout will be lit by LED strips with covers.  Chose these: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01A79H03S?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

I catch them on sale sometimes and almost have enough for my new layout.

Gary Ray

Azle, TX

 

On 7/2/2022 1:36 PM, Scott Kremer wrote:
In addition to the Kelvin rating there is also a CRI, Color Rendition Index, which gives you an idea of the accuracy of the color in question.  CRI’s for bulbs with a value of 90 or less will almost always result in a green cast to the light.  Today finding LED’s, bulbs not tubes,  with a CRI of 90 or higher is expensive.  In most cases a price of $14 to $18 per bulb for a 100 watt equivalent bulb.  That will change and there are some wattages and Kelvin temps with a price of less than $5 per bulb.  Still expensive.  I have not researched tubes but the same criteria applies.  Check out sources on the internet or, if you are lucky, check with your local lighting specialist store.

Scott Kremer

On Jul 2, 2022, at 1:54 PM, Todd Sullivan via groups.io <sullivant41@...> wrote:

Just to add to the discussion, with my last layout, I tried using stock fluorescent bulbs to illuminate the layout room, using twin tube fixtures.  The light emitted gave everything a greenish look.  Not what I was after!  So, I tried some daylight (5000K) bulbs, and everything looked blue and none of the warmer colors (like rusty stuff) showed well.  So, I bought some 3500K warm bulbs and tried them.  Only the warm colors showed well, and I lost all the blues and blacks.  So, I installed one 3500K bulb with a 5000K bulb in the same fixture, and voila!  Close to the full spectrum of colors.

I now live in Texas, and was concerned about adding heat to my layout room (which is on he second floor - no basements here), and I wanted to duplicate the same style of lighting without the heat-producing fluorescents.  I found some 33500K and 5000K strip LED lights on Amazon, but had to devise a way of installing the strips side-by-side on moldings attached to the ceiling.  They work well, but I wish they provided a bit more light.

So, that's another factor in how you choose to color things on your layout.  PS, I try to paint and weather all my structures and rolling stock under the same lighting conditions as the layout room.

Todd Sullivan


John Barry
 

Nelson, Andy,

Not so much on the "anything goes".  Note the reweigh date of 2-64 on the yellowish car in the '47 ship and travel scheme.  Then look at the orange car ahead and note the lack of the 3' herald above the reporting marks.  That would indicate a repaint in the '59 large circle cross scheme.  The base color changed to the more orange shade about that time.  And the patch on the yellowish car is in the new orange paint.

John Barry
 
ATSF North Bay Lines 
Golden Gates & Fast Freights 
Lovettsville, VA


707-490-9696 






On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 12:59:37 PM EDT, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:


Thanks for that photo, Andy. It supports the ‘anything goes’ argument. I color samples a number of prototype and model SFRD reefers and attached the RGB codes and color dots. They pretty much cover the spectrum from yellow to orange. I still haven’t decided which four to use on my reefers.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Andy Carlson
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2022 10:30 AM
To: STMFC <realstmfc@groups.io>
Subject: [RealSTMFC] ATSF reefer colors

 

An interesting view of the differences in "Yellow/Orange"

-Andy Carlson

Ojai CA

 

 

 

Inline image


Scott
 

Interesting that it looks like they repainted the white Santa Fe logo but not the black.  Or the white really stood the test of time.

Scott McDonald 


Rich Yoder
 

We made a  switch to LED Lighting in our home one year ago. As one would expect in as much as everything does wear out some of our brand name LED lighting has worn out in my opinion way too early in what we were led to believe would not only be more energy efficient but would last longer. One lighting fixture bought from The Home Depot wore out and replacement parts  were half the original cost and out of stock. Being out of stock tell the rest of the story. Buyer beware.

Rich

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nelson Moyer
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2022 3:33 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] ATSF reefer colors

 

I researches fluorescent tubes in 2013, looking for 5000 K and a high CRI. I attached a table of the results. Regrettably, the inexpensive tubes are disappearing, and I can no longer find them locally. I’ve decided to switch to LED tubes as the fluorescent tubes fail.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Scott Kremer
Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2022 1:36 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] ATSF reefer colors

 

In addition to the Kelvin rating there is also a CRI, Color Rendition Index, which gives you an idea of the accuracy of the color in question.  CRI’s for bulbs with a value of 90 or less will almost always result in a green cast to the light.  Today finding LED’s, bulbs not tubes,  with a CRI of 90 or higher is expensive.  In most cases a price of $14 to $18 per bulb for a 100 watt equivalent bulb.  That will change and there are some wattages and Kelvin temps with a price of less than $5 per bulb.  Still expensive.  I have not researched tubes but the same criteria applies.  Check out sources on the internet or, if you are lucky, check with your local lighting specialist store.

 

Scott Kremer

 


Tim O'Connor
 


Pre-2020 Massachusetts had an energy program to switch to LEDs (for example, all outdoor street lights
in my town are now LED) and I got overhead 'tube' fixtures to replace fluorescents for $15 a set. They use
40W and put out 300W equivalent at 5000k color temperature. Some cheap Chinese LED bulbs burned out
out in the house, but I have since found good quality products. My electricity bills are lower than ever. :-)

Anyone want some free CFLs ? I have lots of 'em. :-)


On 7/3/2022 9:34 AM, Rich Yoder wrote:

We made a  switch to LED Lighting in our home one year ago. As one would expect in as much as everything does wear out some of our brand name LED lighting has worn out in my opinion way too early in what we were led to believe would not only be more energy efficient but would last longer. One lighting fixture bought from The Home Depot wore out and replacement parts  were half the original cost and out of stock. Being out of stock tell the rest of the story. Buyer beware.

Rich



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts