Topics

Complaint


byronrose@...
 

Okay guys, I've been on this darn fool list for 30 hours now and all I've
seen discussed is dates, airplane glues, trolley cars, and casting
resins. When do we get to the important parts of freight cars? Like fer
instance:

What is the easiest way to model fingerprints on the inside of grab
irons?

What size were the knot holes in the decks of USRA flat cars still in
service in the 40s?

What size were the pivot pins on 1920s era coupler knuckles?

What was the wall thickness of the piping used in the AB brakes added to
PRR X-29 boxcars in 1948?

What was the relative strength of Youngstown ends vs Dreadnaught ends vs
Despatch Shop ends vs Pullman PS-1 ends, with complete structural
analysis?

Where did the pigments come from that were used in making the green paint
on EJ&E box cars?

How old were the pipe fitters who added the AB brakes to that PRR X-29 in
1948?

What RRs box cars were used to ship Firestone tires in the 30s? Did they
blow out then too?

What was the temperature of the crushed ices used in SFRD reefers in the
20s? 30s? Where the cars shaken or stirred?

How were the light bulb packed in those GE covered hoppers?

What railroads box cars had the fuzziest wood siding?

Ooops, I didn't mean that last question. Where the heck is the delete
key now that I need it? After all, I use it so rarely. Oh well, sorry.

BSR
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Gail & Tom Madden <tgmadden@...>
 

The local RPA wrote:

What is the easiest way to model fingerprints on the inside of grab
irons?

Claim your trainmen always wore gloves and forget about it.

What size were the knot holes in the decks of USRA flat cars still in
service in the 40s?

There were not holes in the decks, except those made by knails.

What size were the pivot pins on 1920s era coupler knuckles?

A meaningless question. The pivot pins were not "on" the coupler knuckles -
they were a separate part. If you're going to be a useful contributor to
this group you'll have to be more precise.

What was the wall thickness of the piping used in the AB brakes added to
PRR X-29 boxcars in 1948?

Schedule 40 or Schedule 80?

What was the relative strength of Youngstown ends vs Dreadnaught ends vs
Despatch Shop ends vs Pullman PS-1 ends, with complete structural
analysis?

I'll have to look that up. I believe the testing was done by Mighty Joe
Youngstown.

Where did the pigments come from that were used in making the green paint
on EJ&E box cars?

Joliet. Or Elgin.

How old were the pipe fitters who added the AB brakes to that PRR X-29 in
1948?

Very young. That job was given to those who had only learned the first few
letters of the alphabet.

What RRs box cars were used to ship Firestone tires in the 30s? Did they
blow out then too?

Only if they were inflated. But inflation was very low during the
depression, so it wasn't a problem.

What was the temperature of the crushed ices used in SFRD reefers in the
20s? 30s? Where the cars shaken or stirred?

In the 20s it varied - I believe it was a cube function. In 1933 President
Roosevelt devalued the farenheit. From then on ice was able to adjust its
temperature to the needs of the load.

How were the light bulb packed in those GE covered hoppers?

You mean the ones that lit whenever a hatch was lifted?

What railroads box cars had the fuzziest wood siding?

The Santa Fe had a one-of reefer that was kind of fluffy. Otherwise, I can
put you in touch with a fellow who used to be associated with AMB, who might
be able to help you out.

Good to be on a list with you again, Byron!

Tom

(Mike, this is one of the posts you can remove from the archives!)


Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Tom Madden responds to Byron Rose's first post with:

The local RPA wrote:
Which is all he really needed to say. Unlike most other lists, the STMFC has
an RPA. This is good. Someone...Richard probably knows who...wrote that "you
can't go back". But, in this case, he appears to be wrong.

BTW, as moderator, I decree that express reefers can be discussed on this
list. Yes, they operated frequently on passenger...or mail...trains. But,
they also frequently hauled produce of one form or another...and they are
found in the ORER. More importantly, I am modeling the damned things and
will...as usual...need help. We also have Branchline bringing out some very
useful models soon.

Mike Brock


Richard Hendrickson
 

Mike Brock wrote:

Tom Madden responds to Byron Rose's first post with:

The local RPA wrote:
Which is all he really needed to say. Unlike most other lists, the STMFC has
an RPA. This is good. Someone...Richard probably knows who...wrote that "you
can't go back". But, in this case, he appears to be wrong.
It was Tom Wolfe who wrote "you can't go home again," though the idea
itself wasn't original with him. Many of us wouldn't want to go home again
if we could. But most, if not all, of those on this list are probably
model railroaders out of nostalgia for an earlier era of prototype
railroading. I can tell you from recent experience that a ca. 1953
operating session on the Tehachapi layout in San Diego is the closest thing
to a time machine I ever expect to experience. Running the Grand Canyon up
the hill from Caliente with a timetable in my pocket and a couple of form
19s in my hand is, as Yogi Berra aptly (if redundantly) put it, "deja vu
all over again." And having a troll under the bridge makes it that much
better. So we're fortunate to have our own antiquated troll under the
bridge on this list. Welcome back, Byron.

BTW, as moderator, I decree that express reefers can be discussed on this
list. Yes, they operated frequently on passenger...or mail...trains. But,
they also frequently hauled produce of one form or another...and they are
found in the ORER.
Express reefers were often found in freight trains - there's lots of
documentary evidence for this - when carrying cargoes that weren't
time-sensitive or on empty back hauls. So there's no need to rationalize
discussing them here, unless you're into rationalizing for its own sake.

Richard H. Hendrickson
Ashland, Oregon 97520


byronrose@...
 

Thank you Tom, I'm glad to see that someone on this list is not only
paying attention, but . . . . What was the question again?

On Thu, 14 Dec 2000 00:35:55 -0700 "Gail & Tom Madden"
<tgmadden@...> writes:
The local RPA wrote:

What is the easiest way to model fingerprints on the inside of grab
irons?
Claim your trainmen always wore gloves and forget about it.
Thats a cop-out if I ever heard one. Remind me not to buy any of your
p____r car kits. Oh, that's right, you never made any. Okay, I'll wait
for the tank car underframes.


What size were the knot holes in the decks of USRA flat cars still
in
service in the 40s?
There were not holes in the decks, except those made by knails.
I have photographs that show knot holes. All I want to know is what was
the recommended size of them. Is that too much to ask?


What size were the pivot pins on 1920s era coupler knuckles?
A meaningless question. The pivot pins were not "on" the coupler
knuckles -
they were a separate part. If you're going to be a useful
contributor to
this group you'll have to be more precise.
Let me rephrase that question: What size were the pivot pins used with
1920s era coupler knuckles?


What was the wall thickness of the piping used in the AB brakes
added to
PRR X-29 boxcars in 1948?
Schedule 40 or Schedule 80?
That's a part of my question. If I knew the answer to that I could look
it up in my Funk and Wagnells.


What was the relative strength of Youngstown ends vs Dreadnaught
ends vs
Despatch Shop ends vs Pullman PS-1 ends, with complete structural
analysis?
I'll have to look that up. I believe the testing was done by Mighty
Joe Youngstown.
Tom, I think you made that name up. I'm glad I didn't say Murphy end or
you'd give me some name like Murphy Chowderhead. But thanks for taking
the time to look it up for me. I will be anxiously awaiting your reply.


Where did the pigments come from that were used in making the green
paint
on EJ&E box cars?
Joliet. Or Elgin.
Finally, a real answer. Thank you. But do you have an address? I'd
like to pick some up next time I'm in Joliet for a box car I'm building
from scratch. Or is that scratching to build? I always forget.

How old were the pipe fitters who added the AB brakes to that PRR
X-29 in 1948?

Very young. That job was given to those who had only learned the
first few letters of the alphabet.
I guess you had to have more seniority to work on K brakes.


What RRs box cars were used to ship Firestone tires in the 30s?
Did they blow out then too?

Only if they were inflated. But inflation was very low during the
depression, so it wasn't a problem.
And I suppose there were very few explorers then too. But you didn't
answer the first part of the question.


What was the temperature of the crushed ices used in SFRD reefers
in the 20s? 30s? Were the cars shaken or stirred?
In the 20s it varied - I believe it was a cube function. In 1933
President
Roosevelt devalued the farenheit. From then on ice was able to
adjust its
temperature to the needs of the load.
But this time you didn't answer the third part of the question.


How were the light bulb packed in those GE covered hoppers?
You mean the ones that lit whenever a hatch was lifted?
Yes.


What railroads box cars had the fuzziest wood siding?
The Santa Fe had a one-of reefer that was kind of fluffy. Otherwise,
I can
put you in touch with a fellow who used to be associated with AMB,
who might be able to help you out.
Yeah, like the same way I came in?


Good to be on a list with you again, Byron!
Tom, you can call me BS. And you're welcome.

BS


Mike, this is another one of the posts you can remove from the archives!

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Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

Oh, that's right, you never made any. Okay, I'll wait for the tank car
underframes<

Speaking of tank car frames I have all these tanks waiting--------!

Might be a good time for Mike to state whether Way cars, er Cabooses,
are within our freight car topics. Also are we going to include Drover
cars? Some heavy questions for the moderator to decide!

Jon Miller
AT&SF
For me time has stopped in 1941
Digitrax DCC owner, Chief system
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Jeff Aley - GCD PE <jaley@...>
 

On Dec 14, 1:37am, byronrose@... wrote:
Subject: [STMFC] Complaint

What size were the knot holes in the decks of USRA flat cars still in
service in the 40s?
They ranged from 1.25 to 2.5 inches. Larger knot holes would have caused
the wood to be a different grade and thus unsuitable for flat car decks.
[*].

Coincidentally, for those who model in HO scale, basswood exhibits knots
that are exactly to scale for this application. Therefore we see that (as
usual) wood is the best material to use if one wants to model wood. [**]

Regards,

-Jeff

[*]: Not really. I made this up.
[**]: I am reminded of the sport of "bear baiting"...

--
Jeff Aley, Development Engineer jaley@...
Graphics Components Division
Intel Corporation, Folsom, CA
(916) 356-3533


Max Robin
 

Welcome back Byron!!

And just what size were the rivets used on the thousands of channel
side hoppers on the WM to secure the channels to the side sheets and
framing?

Max


byronrose@...
 

On Mon, 18 Dec 2000 14:12:08 -0000 "Max Robin" <m_robin@...>
writes:
Welcome back Byron!!

And just what size were the rivets used on the thousands of channel
side hoppers on the WM to secure the channels to the side sheets and

framing?
Thank you Max.

As I recall from the 2-3 WM channel sides that I saw several years ago in
Harrisburg, the rivets are slightly larger than the ones used in box car
siding. If I had to venture a guess, I'd say they were probably 1/2"
rivets with a full 1" diameter head. In HO modeling terms, the NWSL
.010" rivet set would be awful close, especially after painting.

I recently saw a GA drawing of WMs built in the 30s but didn't have time
to study such details. If I get another chance, I'll let you know.

Or, next time I'm in H'burg, I could measure them on the cars still
extant, those being of the 1952 rebuilt variety. I will probably be
there this spring.

Byron
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