Freight car ID


Clark Propst
 

Anymore have any "guesses" as to these freight cars?

My modeling guesses would be the Roundhouse hopper could be used to model the three bay hopper and the last car might be a AAR 1937 design, but can't name the RR from the emblem...


Robert kirkham
 

Could the image be reversed - so the tilted rectangle might run the opposite direction?  I assume you have the “not zoomed” version?

Rob

On Jul 2, 2022, at 7:34 AM, Clark Propst via groups.io <cepropst@...> wrote:

Anymore have any "guesses" as to these freight cars?

My modeling guesses would be the Roundhouse hopper could be used to model the three bay hopper and the last car might be a AAR 1937 design, but can't name the RR from the emblem... <Freight cars.jpg>


Clark Propst
 

Here's the rest of the photo. Even I know the first car, a Pennsy X31 something or other  ;  ))

I've also added a couple photos of the same train with an interesting flat cat behind the engine. If you look closely you'll see the ends of the car are painted with a brighter color for some purpose. No idea what RR that car is either. Again another Pennsy box car an X29 with 'buy war bonds' stenciling.
Clark Propst


Robert kirkham
 

Those are tough.  All i have are conjectured observations . . . 

Starting with the car ahead of the caboose, the roof line is obscured by a building in the distance; i’d guess it is peaked, not rounded.  Side sill tabs are evident along the bottom of the car side.   There appears to be writing on the car side to the right of the door - as well as a logo.  I think the logo is a tilted rectangle, lower side at the right (which rules out a number of RRs).  It's not diamond shaped (as on the Erie).  I see a straight outline along the top of the logo, so not a Wabash “flag".  To me, that seems to point to Milwaukee Road.   But I see no ribs in the side sheathing.  Zooming in on the car end, I think there are two panels.   

Moving forward a car, it looks to be 6 or more inches shorter. Its roof is also obscured by buildings in the distance.  But i think it's a peaked roof.  The significant shadow this side of the door confirms a boxcar.  It appears to have very square corners/sharp differences between sides and ends.   That could (but needn’t) indicate double sheathed siding.  Given the position of the top door track, i think there is a significant top fascia.   I think there is a hint of an exposed, inset side sill.  The logo looks somewhat round  - Damage in the negative obscures this a tiny bit - so it may not be precisely circular.  Seems the sides of the logo are less defined than the top and bottom.  I notice that the logo is placed mid height, rather than higher on the car side.    Could it be DT&I?  not sure about anyone else with mid-height logos, not sure when DT&I did that, its probably a later phenomena.    

I don’t know anything about hoppers (CPR used gons in my era).

The 4th car from the caboose has 5/5/5 Murphy ends, and a significant overhang of the sides over the sills, so i think a re-built USRA car.  Is that a pair of doors?    Lettering right of the door looks to be two words on top, a short word (maybe “&") below, and a third word below that. 

Not much to say here.

Rob   


On Jul 2, 2022, at 10:35 AM, Clark Propst via groups.io <cepropst@...> wrote:

Here's the rest of the photo. Even I know the first car, a Pennsy X31 something or other  ;  ))

I've also added a couple photos of the same train with an interesting flat cat behind the engine. If you look closely you'll see the ends of the car are painted with a brighter color for some purpose. No idea what RR that car is either. Again another Pennsy box car an X29 with 'buy war bonds' stenciling.
Clark Propst <Scan0142.jpg><Near Zearing 6-24-46 JH.jpg><LS M_StL 333 Roland Ia.jpg>


Tim O'Connor
 

Clark

Hopper could be IC.

The emblem on that box car appears to be tilted. Who used tilted emblems ?


On 7/2/2022 10:34 AM, Clark Propst via groups.io wrote:
Anymore have any "guesses" as to these freight cars?

My modeling guesses would be the Roundhouse hopper could be used to model the three bay hopper and the last car might be a AAR 1937 design, but can't name the RR from the emblem...

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


radiodial868
 

I'll throw my thought out there on the boxcar, too.  Image clarity is rather distorted, so can't say it is 100% a tilted herald.  It does has a certain Bangor and Aroostook feel to it.
Railroad company logo design evolution
--
-------------------
RJ Dial

Mendocino, CA


Clark Propst
 

I've been troubled trying to think of who had a titled large emblem like that on the last box car. To the best of my knowledge during the war years the only box car on the Milwaukee with tilted box emblems we single sheathed box car and that emblem was on the extreme upper left and much smaller.
That hopper could very well be an IC car.
To me the first box car after the tank car looks like a NYC door and a half box car. Not sure who else might have had short steel box cars with that door configuration?
Clark
No guesses on the flat car?


O Fenton Wells
 

CNJ has the door and a half, I believe Sunshine made a kit in HO


On Mon, Jul 4, 2022 at 10:14 AM Clark Propst via groups.io <cepropst=q.com@groups.io> wrote:
I've been troubled trying to think of who had a titled large emblem like that on the last box car. To the best of my knowledge during the war years the only box car on the Milwaukee with tilted box emblems we single sheathed box car and that emblem was on the extreme upper left and much smaller.
That hopper could very well be an IC car.
To me the first box car after the tank car looks like a NYC door and a half box car. Not sure who else might have had short steel box cars with that door configuration?
Clark
No guesses on the flat car?



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


David
 

The car behind the tank has the half door on the right, so the most likely candidate is the steel-sided rebuilds of C&O/HV double (wood) sheathed auto boxes.

David Thompson


Tim O'Connor
 


The lettering on the 1 1/2 door box car looks like it could be Chesapeake & Ohio, which did have
1 1/2 door steel box cars.

The "tilted herald" on further examination appears to be CIRCULAR, and this is most likely a Southern Pacific emblem.

I remember we discussed this photo a long time ago because of that SELEY composite hopper car !

Has anyone identified the builder of the tank car?


On 7/4/2022 10:13 AM, Clark Propst via groups.io wrote:
I've been troubled trying to think of who had a titled large emblem like that on the last box car. To the best of my knowledge during the war years the only box car on the Milwaukee with tilted box emblems we single sheathed box car and that emblem was on the extreme upper left and much smaller.
That hopper could very well be an IC car.
To me the first box car after the tank car looks like a NYC door and a half box car. Not sure who else might have had short steel box cars with that door configuration?
Clark
No guesses on the flat car?

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Clark Propst
 

On Mon, Jul 4, 2022 at 08:36 AM, Tim O'Connor wrote:
The lettering on the 1 1/2 door box car looks like it could be Chesapeake & Ohio, which did have
1 1/2 door steel box cars.

The "tilted herald" on further examination appears to be CIRCULAR, and this is most likely a Southern Pacific emblem.

I remember we discussed this photo a long time ago because of that SELEY composite hopper car !

Has anyone identified the builder of the tank car?
Nice C&O photo. The car in the train appears to have solid steel doors. But, the stacked lettering look like it could spell that road name? 
Possibility it's SP?
Yes, the Seley hopper was discussed, good memory. I built the F&C kit. Very nice model.
I'm far from a tank car guy, would be nice to know that too.
Clark 


Clark Propst
 

Here's another interesting bit I just figured out. I've known for a long time the car behind the engine featured in this photo had PM reporting marks on the end. I zoomed in as best I could and saw other worn stenciling below the top line. I checked Gene Green's records and found that PM cars were bought used by the M&StL in 37 and 39. The photo was taken in 41 and to me anyway it looks like the PM number has been at least lined through and M&StL initials were stenciled under the PM initials/number. 
An early patch job? Freshly painted cars from this group have dates of 40 and 41. Maybe this car is about to be refurbished?
Clark


O Fenton Wells
 

Great eyes. 


On Jul 4, 2022, at 12:42 PM, Clark Propst via groups.io <cepropst@...> wrote:

Here's another interesting bit I just figured out. I've known for a long time the car behind the engine featured in this photo had PM reporting marks on the end. I zoomed in as best I could and saw other worn stenciling below the top line. I checked Gene Green's records and found that PM cars were bought used by the M&StL in 37 and 39. The photo was taken in 41 and to me anyway it looks like the PM number has been at least lined through and M&StL initials were stenciled under the PM initials/number. 
An early patch job? Freshly painted cars from this group have dates of 40 and 41. Maybe this car is about to be refurbished?
Clark Zearing Ia 9-13-41 Bill Armstrong.png


Douglas Harding
 

Here is what Gene Green wrote about the PM cars acquired by the MSTL

 

25000 - 25298

 

A group of 150 used USRA double-sheathed box cars were purchased from Hyman-Michaels on July 1, 1937 and were numbered from 25000

to 25298.  The purchase contract for these cars required a payment of 85 cents per day per car which was less than the $1 per diem charges of the time.  Actual cost per car was $1,220.00 including interest charges.  The cars were "like money in the

bank provided we keep 'em moving," to quote an M&StL employee of the day.  As it worked out the cars earned an average of 52 cents per day leaving only 33 cents to be paid by the M&StL.

 

25000s

ex-PM 80000 series USRA box cars.

7 cars built Dec 1919

134 cars built Jan 1920

4 cars built Feb 1920

4 cars built Mar 1920

1 cars built Apr 1920

Car cards dated July 1937

 

 

A "Summary of Freight Equipment" lists the 25000 series as having been built by Standard Steel Car Co. in 1921 while the equipment diagram says they were built in 1920.  These cars were readied for service by the M&StL's Marshalltown car shops.  During this period the M&StL performed repairs or even rebuilt the various groups of used cars and then repainted them before placing them

in service.

 

The first 50 were added to the roster almost immediately in July 1937 when the number series 25000 to 25298 first appeared in The Official Railway Equipment Register.  Because the 25000s closely resembled the original USRA 22000 series box cars, they have occasionally been confused with the M&StL's original USRA box cars in the hobby press.

 

 

Doug Harding

https://www.facebook.com/douglas.harding.3156/

Youtube: Douglas Harding Iowa Central Railroad

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Clark Propst via groups.io
Sent: Monday, July 4, 2022 11:43 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Freight car ID

 

Here's another interesting bit I just figured out. I've known for a long time the car behind the engine featured in this photo had PM reporting marks on the end. I zoomed in as best I could and saw other worn stenciling below the top line. I checked Gene Green's records and found that PM cars were bought used by the M&StL in 37 and 39. The photo was taken in 41 and to me anyway it looks like the PM number has been at least lined through and M&StL initials were stenciled under the PM initials/number. 
An early patch job? Freshly painted cars from this group have dates of 40 and 41. Maybe this car is about to be refurbished?
Clark


al_brown03
 

That C&O car is *cool*. Has anyone made a kit of it?

Al Brown
Melbourne, Fla.


Clark Propst
 

Checking the photo again it could very well have corrugated doors. Must likely the C&O car!
One down  ;  ))

Clark