Topics

Gondola identification

Ted Schnepf
 

Hello Everyone,

Gondola's are the forgotten railroad cars.  Very little had been written about them and there are so many variations.

I want to ID a mill type gon.  Its inside  length is 47' 6" and inside height about 3' 9". The sides have a straight sill (no fish belly) with 12 panels and 11 side stakes.  The fixed ends are dreadnought.  The car is riveted construction.

I started by looking at PRR books, but no match  (a G31D might be close).  Mr Kresse's  book about C&O gons show one of the correct general length, but has taller sides for use in coal hauling.  Thought about a USRA  mill gon, but doesn't seem to match.

In most freight car books, gons are very limited in space covered. 

Can anyone identify my roughly 49 foot, 11 side stake, riveted gondola?

Ted Schnepf
126 Will Scarlet,
Elgin, Ill. 60120


847=697-5353

mopacfirst
 

Do you have a picture, or some other way we can see what you're describing?  As a total shot in the dark, there was a class of SP gons at about 48' that I think were straight sides.  I built a model of one, perhaps from Speedwitch, but both the model and my SP books are packed so I can't be more specific.

Ron Merrick

Ted Schnepf
 

Hi Ron,

I looked in Thompson's SP book and did not see a match.  The model does not have any drop doors.

Ted Schnepf
126 Will Scarlet,
Elgin, Ill. 60120


847=697-5353


On Monday, January 6, 2020, 07:14:40 PM CST, mopacfirst <ron.merrick@...> wrote:


Do you have a picture, or some other way we can see what you're describing?  As a total shot in the dark, there was a class of SP gons at about 48' that I think were straight sides.  I built a model of one, perhaps from Speedwitch, but both the model and my SP books are packed so I can't be more specific.

Ron Merrick

mel perry
 

a picture would be nice, so we would
know what you are talking about?
thanks 
mel perry

On Mon, Jan 6, 2020, 6:40 PM Ted Schnepf <railsunl@...> wrote:
Hi Ron,

I looked in Thompson's SP book and did not see a match.  The model does not have any drop doors.

Ted Schnepf
126 Will Scarlet,
Elgin, Ill. 60120


847=697-5353


On Monday, January 6, 2020, 07:14:40 PM CST, mopacfirst <ron.merrick@...> wrote:


Do you have a picture, or some other way we can see what you're describing?  As a total shot in the dark, there was a class of SP gons at about 48' that I think were straight sides.  I built a model of one, perhaps from Speedwitch, but both the model and my SP books are packed so I can't be more specific.

Ron Merrick

Tim O'Connor
 


The B&O had 47'1" IL TOFC flat cars (P-54) rebuilt from O-27 gondolas.

A PRR G31D is NOTHING like your description.



On 1/6/2020 5:04 PM, Ted Schnepf wrote:
Hello Everyone,

Gondola's are the forgotten railroad cars.  Very little had been written about them and there are so many variations.

I want to ID a mill type gon.  Its inside  length is 47' 6" and inside height about 3' 9". The sides have a straight sill (no fish belly) with 12 panels and 11 side stakes.  The fixed ends are dreadnought.  The car is riveted construction.

I started by looking at PRR books, but no match  (a G31D might be close).  Mr Kresse's  book about C&O gons show one of the correct general length, but has taller sides for use in coal hauling.  Thought about a USRA  mill gon, but doesn't seem to match.

In most freight car books, gons are very limited in space covered. 

Can anyone identify my roughly 49 foot, 11 side stake, riveted gondola?

Ted Schnepf
126 Will Scarlet,
Elgin, Ill. 60120


847=697-5353

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Ted Schnepf
 

Hi Tim,

Thanks for the lead.  The O27 matches my car in appearance.  Only difference is 12 ribs versus 11 on the model.

Ted Schnepf
126 Will Scarlet,
Elgin, Ill. 60120


847=697-5353


On Tuesday, January 7, 2020, 08:38:54 AM CST, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



The B&O had 47'1" IL TOFC flat cars (P-54) rebuilt from O-27 gondolas.

A PRR G31D is NOTHING like your description.



On 1/6/2020 5:04 PM, Ted Schnepf wrote:

Hello Everyone,

Gondola's are the forgotten railroad cars.  Very little had been written about them and there are so many variations.

I want to ID a mill type gon.  Its inside  length is 47' 6" and inside height about 3' 9". The sides have a straight sill (no fish belly) with 12 panels and 11 side stakes.  The fixed ends are dreadnought.  The car is riveted construction.

I started by looking at PRR books, but no match  (a G31D might be close).  Mr Kresse's  book about C&O gons show one of the correct general length, but has taller sides for use in coal hauling.  Thought about a USRA  mill gon, but doesn't seem to match.

In most freight car books, gons are very limited in space covered. 

Can anyone identify my roughly 49 foot, 11 side stake, riveted gondola?

Ted Schnepf
126 Will Scarlet,
Elgin, Ill. 60120


847=697-5353

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Jack Mullen
 

Ted, 
Have you looked at PRR G29 class?  True, IL is only 46', but it's 3'8" IH with 11 stake sides.

NYC also had 11 stake steel gons, but the ones I'm aware of, 324xxx series, are 50' IL and a foot taller.

Most steel, straight-side mill gons seem to have an odd number of panels. Could yours be a composite gon that's been resheathed with diagonal truss members removed? A number of roads had 12 panel composite gons with straight sills, including your Milwaukee, iirc.

It would *really* help to have a photo. There are many details that might cue recognition, or tend to support or reject a possible match. A few such as whether the centersill is straight or fishbelly;  end sills flush or projecting; spacing of stakes and their shape might be described, but it's a lot easier to recognize a picture of a face than a description.

Jack Mullen