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21 - 40 of 44
Missing links
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Greg Martin
Guys,
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A possible candidate for consideration is the post-war rebuilt boxcars that came from the RR's rebuilding with an ARR box on a earlier underframes. Certainly we know that the ATSF, KCS,PRR, WABASH and the ACL did this and I am sure others are well. It would require tooling for a variety of underframes, roofs and ends, but the "box" remained the same. (yes, I realize the ACL cars were only 10'-3" IH, but my eyes can't measure 3 scale inches without a micrometer). Once the tooling was complete the idea would be to mix and match the possible ends, roofs and underframes to cover as many roads as one could. The PRR had two classes as well as the ACL and I am not an ATSF expert, but I believe there was more than one. The Wabash and the DT&I had cars that mirrored the PRR X26c as well. The PRR continued the practice well into the 1950s like the ACL, being frugal was the name of the game at the time. If you include double door cars the list grows. The trucks were recycled (the re-use of Andrews trucks by some) as well. It would take research and forethought before one jumped in, but it does open many doors for sales to prototype modelers. Greg Martin -----Original Message-----
From: Armand Premo <armprem2@...> To: STMFC@... Sent: Thu, Oct 22, 2009 11:03 am Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Missing links Gang,I kind of suspected that there would be a regional influence for nominees.While offset hoppers seem to dominate the interest of eastern aficionados ,there are still many other types of hoppers that are totally missing from the scene.I will attempt to collate the choices and put it to a vote.While hoppers seem to be of only marginal interest to western prototype modelers some other cars appear to have a more uniform appeal.Armand Premo . |
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SUVCWORR@...
Armand,
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I would suggest including the NYC USRA clones, Rich Orr -----Original Message-----
From: Armand Premo <armprem2@...> To: STMFC@... Sent: Thu, Oct 22, 2009 1:03 pm Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Missing links Gang,I kind of suspected that there would be a regional influence for nominees.While offset hoppers seem to dominate the interest of eastern aficionados ,there are still many other types of hoppers that are totally missing from the scene.I will attempt to collate the choices and put it to a vote.While hoppers seem to be of only marginal interest to western prototype modelers some other cars appear to have a more uniform appeal.Armand Premo Subject: [STMFC] Re: Missing links Tony, a big ditto here! I dearly would like to have several prewar SP flat cars. Good examples would be something like the F-50-9 and F-50-13 which were very distinct from each other and both classes lasted past 1960. SP used to run long cuts of empty flat cars back to Oregon. I've seen it in photos and even in Hollywood movies! Tim O'Connor >3. I make it no. 3 only out of humility: the Harriman flat car with >straight side sills, either the 40-foot or 50-foot version (if we had >forties, we could kitbash the fifty-footers). > >Tony Thompson ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.422 / Virus Database: 270.14.20/2444 - Release Date: 10/18/09 09:04:00 ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links |
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Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
Garth Groff wrote:
I don't think so, at least not easily. It would involve cutting out alternate boards across the end, less the end braces. You would probably spend less effort building Al's kit. [Which reminds me, I've got to put mine together someday. :-[ ]Extremely similar cars except for the narrow slots between boards on the ends. These are NOT alternate boards, but look like kind of quarter-board widths. I would just cut some slots, but as you say, with the bracing it's not an easy job. An approximation could be made by wide grooves which you fill with black. Don't know about WP trucks, but on the SP cars, the S-40-5 had Vulcan trucks, the S-40-8 T-section trucks. Thats' the other distinctive feature, along with the ends. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@... Publishers of books on railroad history |
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Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
Tony,
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I don't think so, at least not easily. It would involve cutting out alternate boards across the end, less the end braces. You would probably spend less effort building Al's kit. [Which reminds me, I've got to put mine together someday. :-[ ] Are there other differences between the SP S-40-5 and the S-40-8? The WP cars were a supposed to be a clone of the latter class. Kind regards, Garth G. Groff Anthony Thompson wrote: Garth Groff wrote: |
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Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
Garth Groff wrote:
You mention the SP/WP stock cars, and I gather that you are speaking of the styrene Red Caboose models and not Westerfield's resin kits. In point of fact, there is NO WP stock car from RC. The ends are solid wood, and the WP cars had open slatted upper ends. I have passed on the RC car for just that reason (also because of the absurd price). The car is an SP S-40-5 and nothing else.Garth, is the model fixable for WP? open up some slots, etc.? I haven't looked at it with that in mind. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@... Publishers of books on railroad history |
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Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
Dave,
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You mention the SP/WP stock cars, and I gather that you are speaking of the styrene Red Caboose models and not Westerfield's resin kits. In point of fact, there is NO WP stock car from RC. The ends are solid wood, and the WP cars had open slatted upper ends. I have passed on the RC car for just that reason (also because of the absurd price). The car is an SP S-40-5 and nothing else. Kind regards, Garth Groff ealabhan0 wrote: . . . the ATSF and SP/WP stock cars, you echo my point about manufacturers issuing unique one-(or two-)road plain paint cars . . . . |
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Armand Premo
Gang,I kind of suspected that there would be a regional influence for nominees.While offset hoppers seem to dominate the interest of eastern aficionados ,there are still many other types of hoppers that are totally missing from the scene.I will attempt to collate the choices and put it to a vote.While hoppers seem to be of only marginal interest to western prototype modelers some other cars appear to have a more uniform appeal.Armand Premo
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Missing links Tony, a big ditto here! I dearly would like to have several prewar SP flat cars. Good examples would be something like the F-50-9 and F-50-13 which were very distinct from each other and both classes lasted past 1960. SP used to run long cuts of empty flat cars back to Oregon. I've seen it in photos and even in Hollywood movies! Tim O'Connor >3. I make it no. 3 only out of humility: the Harriman flat car with >straight side sills, either the 40-foot or 50-foot version (if we had >forties, we could kitbash the fifty-footers). > >Tony Thompson ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.422 / Virus Database: 270.14.20/2444 - Release Date: 10/18/09 09:04:00 |
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Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
Chuck Peck wrote:
Yes, Tony, a hopper car. A basic offset side two bay hopper with optional ends . . .Actually, I do know. It just won't impact MY modeling if it's produced. But I would never speak against the introduction of such a model. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@... Publishers of books on railroad history |
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David Sieber
Tim,
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Yeah, I know; UTL X-3s have been on "most wanted" lists at least since the "Model Railroading" survey/lists of the '80s - and they're still needed. The underframe could also be used for X-4 insulated and X-5 pressurized tanks. Some X-5s had lessor markings (e.g., Skelgas); not sure if any X-4s had lessor paint. These cars surely were seen on just about every railroad and would fit anywhere. With the ATSF and SP/WP stock cars, you echo my point about manufacturers issuing unique one-(or two-)road plain paint cars. How about the ATSF Caswell gon, PRR K7 stock car, Central Valley NP stock car, or many Bowser Pennsy cars, some only in PRR and predecessor and subsidiary lettering? We could even go back to Athearn blue box UP stock car and UP grainloading boxes (sorta'), plus classic ATSF and SP cabeese - though also in many bogus paint schemes. Someone really should do the ubiquitous UTL X-3 and other common tank cars. The "one boring paint scheme" excuse can't explain why no styrene GATC type 30 tank cars. The old Athearn blue box 12,500gal (almost-)UP/SP tank car and modified unreal 3-dome cars (and AHM, etc., copies) were a poor attempt to continue the yellow box GATC tanks in different sizes that were excellent early '50s metal kits. While those metal underframes had no bolster-end poling pocket detail, they did exhibit most characteristics of the GATC tank car frame. It can be frustrating trying to assemble resin tank car kits that are often at best fiddley and/or don't quite fit together; see the recent STMFC GATX 30 underframe thread. That's why I continue the call for UTLX and GATC tank cars in styrene, in the hope that others will add to the hue and cry until some manufacturer hears the potential sales market. After all, 10 years ago, who would have expected that two firms would issue the ACF type 21 and the type 27, both in 8K and 10K capacities, one even also with the insulated tank?. I can deal better with model shortcomings than with the complete lack of a common prototype car. Regards, Dave Sieber Reno NV --- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:
4. UTL X-3 (etc.) tank carsDave that tank car has been on the wish list for so long |
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lnnrr <lnnrr@...>
Yes, Tony, a hopper car. A basic offset side two bay hopper with
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optional ends to cover flat, full heap shields, and notched heap shields. Separate grabs and ladders. AND priced for those of us who need dozens of them. Think solid trains of L&N cars on PRR rails headed for the Great Lakes, Pittsburg, etc. Other roads too, of course. Some roads bought them in lots of 1000 and more. I personally don't need quite the full thousand. Chuck Peck --- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:
> 4. There is some kinda hopper car that people argue about all the |
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mopacfirst
And the GATC covered hopper, either 2-bay or 3-bay.
Ron Merrick |
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Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
Armand,
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My votes are for General American 46' GS gondolas, both D&RGW and WP variants (they had different gate mechanisms); AC&F 10K high walkway and low walkway tanks; and SP 40' flatcars. All these are echoes of what others have asked for. We are finally going to get an affordable Gould-design caboose as used by the D&RGW, MP, WP, SN, CCT and TS. See http://www.lakejunctionmodels.com/ . Kind regards, Garth Groff Armand Premo wrote: Folks,Isn't it about time that we submit a list of those cars needed,but missing.There will likely be geographical differences,but let's see if there are any common cars that have yet to see the light of day.Armand Premo |
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4. UTL X-3 (etc.) tank carsDave that tank car has been on the wish list for so long I think we've all just given up on it... The usual reason given is that it had only one owner and a boring paint scheme. But then Intermountain did a Santa Fe stock car, and Red Caboose did an SP stock car, and so on -- surely the X-3 travelled on MOST class 1 railroads did it not? Tim O'Connor |
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Tony, a big ditto here!
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I dearly would like to have several prewar SP flat cars. Good examples would be something like the F-50-9 and F-50-13 which were very distinct from each other and both classes lasted past 1960. SP used to run long cuts of empty flat cars back to Oregon. I've seen it in photos and even in Hollywood movies! Tim O'Connor 3. I make it no. 3 only out of humility: the Harriman flat car with |
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David Sieber
Armand, and Group,
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Let me second the motion from several others for the following freight cars - in plastic, with state of the art details, please: 1. AAR alternate standard 50T offset twin hopper 2. GS gondolas in Pullman Standard and Pressed Steel Car versions 3. GATC type 30 tank cars 4. UTL X-3 (etc.) tank cars 5. PFE R-40-27 and FGE/WFE/BREX/MNX plug door 40-ft reefers The above should be reasonable projects for plastic manufacturers. After all, over the past few years, various firms have tooled exceptional ACF 1958cuft and Airslide 2600cuft covered hoppers, PS-2 2- and 3-bay covered hoppers, plus unique ATSF, PRR, and Harriman stock cars, even Caswell gons, as just a few examples of recent offerings. Modular ends, sides, roofs, etc., could cover most variations in the reefers, as already done by some manufacturers for box car variants (and taken advantage of by those of us who further modify or kit-mingle to model less-common prototypes like the early riveted PS-1 box cars). Dave Sieber Reno NV --- In STMFC@..., "Armand Premo" <armprem2@...> wrote:
Folks,Isn't it about time that we submit a list of those cars needed, but missing.There will likely be geographical differences,but let's see if there are any common cars that have yet to see the light of day. Armand Premo |
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Armand Premo
No,I meant submit_. The higher authority of which you speak are the members of this list.We have spent much time reading about relatively obscure cars while larger groups of cars go begging.It was my original thought, after hearing from all those interested, was to refine the list of cars and submit it to manufacturers for their consideration.for future projects.Armand Premo
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----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Thompson To: STMFC@... Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 6:43 PM Subject: [STMFC] Re: Missing links Armand Premo wrote: > Folks,Isn't it about time that we submit a list of those cars > needed, but missing. I assume, Armand, that you meant "create," not "submit" (unless you're in touch with a Higher Authority in the hobby than i know about). Here's what I'd say: 1. The GSC cast steel depressed center flat car, and maybe the 4- truck "flat" flat car. 2. The 46-foot GS gondola used in the West, either the very early D&RGW style or the later Enterprise cars of both D&RGW and WP (and others--Richard has a list). The former are practically signature cars of the Rio Grande (back in the era of this list, the railroad used to run ads helping you with pronunciation: "Say Rye-o Grand," evidently avoiding any hint that the line had Hispanic roots <g>). 3. I make it no. 3 only out of humility: the Harriman flat car with straight side sills, either the 40-foot or 50-foot version (if we had forties, we could kitbash the fifty-footers). 4. There is some kinda hopper car that people argue about all the time, about which I know little and can't use anyway, but from all the flames and smoke it must be needed by SOMEONE. <vbg> Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@... Publishers of books on railroad history ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.422 / Virus Database: 270.14.20/2444 - Release Date: 10/18/09 09:04:00 |
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Richard Townsend
1. I'll echo Tony's call for the enterprise GS gon.
2. Multi-dome tank cars. AC&F, others? 3. High-walkway AC&F tank cars. I'll be happy with single dome; others may want more. With these, in plastic, I would be happy. Richard Townsend Lincoln City, Oregon |
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Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
Armand Premo wrote:
Folks,Isn't it about time that we submit a list of those cars needed, but missing.I assume, Armand, that you meant "create," not "submit" (unless you're in touch with a Higher Authority in the hobby than i know about). Here's what I'd say: 1. The GSC cast steel depressed center flat car, and maybe the 4- truck "flat" flat car. 2. The 46-foot GS gondola used in the West, either the very early D&RGW style or the later Enterprise cars of both D&RGW and WP (and others--Richard has a list). The former are practically signature cars of the Rio Grande (back in the era of this list, the railroad used to run ads helping you with pronunciation: "Say Rye-o Grand," evidently avoiding any hint that the line had Hispanic roots <g>). 3. I make it no. 3 only out of humility: the Harriman flat car with straight side sills, either the 40-foot or 50-foot version (if we had forties, we could kitbash the fifty-footers). 4. There is some kinda hopper car that people argue about all the time, about which I know little and can't use anyway, but from all the flames and smoke it must be needed by SOMEONE. <vbg> Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@... Publishers of books on railroad history |
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Jim & Lisa Hayes <jimandlisa97225@...>
The usual reason for Sunshine to drop a kit is that demand has dropped off
and they've run out of something, decals for example, that have a minimum reorder quantity way beyond expected sales. Jim Hayes Portland Oregon www.sunshinekits.com |
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Armand Premo
Rich, initially I was thinking solely in terms of numbers of cars.Your question expands the parameters..Armand Premo
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Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 5:52 PM Subject: Re: [STMFC] Missing links Armand, By common do you mean owned by a large number of roads or existed in large quantities?. They are not necessarily one and the same. Rich Orr -----Original Message-----
From: Armand Premo <armprem2@...> To: STMFC@... Sent: Wed, Oct 21, 2009 2:54 pm Subject: [STMFC] Missing links Folks,Isn't it about time that we submit a list of those cars needed,but missing.There will likely be geographical differences,but let's see if there are any common cars that have yet to see the light of day.Armand Premo ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.422 / Virus Database: 270.14.20/2444 - Release Date: 10/18/09 09:04:00 |
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