Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)


Bob Chaparro
 

Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

A photo from the Gateway To Oklahoma History website.

Description:

“A photograph showing railroad car filled with watermelons shipped from Cement, Oklahoma”

Bob Chaparro

Moderator

Railway Bull Shippers Group

https://groups.io/g/RailwayBullShippersGroup


Dennis Storzek <dennis@...>
 

On Wed, May 25, 2022 at 02:38 PM, Bob Chaparro wrote:
“A photograph showing railroad car filled with watermelons shipped from Cement, Oklahoma”
Question... Do they have to be rested after 28 hours? :-)

Dennis Storzek


Todd Sullivan
 

Probably not, but they probably need to be sprayed with water (like hogs) every 28 hours. ;-)

Todd Sullivan


Robert G P
 

I know this was done as late as the 40s, any insight on how long it lasted and what other produce was shipped this way? Pumpkins I bet. 

-Bob G.P

On Wed, May 25, 2022 at 6:53 PM Todd Sullivan via groups.io <sullivant41=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Probably not, but they probably need to be sprayed with water (like hogs) every 28 hours. ;-)

Todd Sullivan


Bill Parks
 

I assume the stock cars got a good cleaning/disinfecting before loading the watermelons

--
Bill Parks
Cumming, GA
Modelling the Seaboard Airline in Central Florida


Eric Hansmann
 

Bill,

A thorough cleaning and disinfecting is standard procedure after a load of cattle is delivered. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

On May 25, 2022, at 7:34 PM, Bill Parks via groups.io <BPARKS_43@...> wrote:

I assume the stock cars got a good cleaning/disinfecting before loading the watermelons

--
Bill Parks
Cumming, GA
Modelling the Seaboard Airline in Central Florida


Tony Thompson
 

Bill Parks wrote:

I assume the stock cars got a good cleaning/disinfecting before loading the watermelons

Yep, after every trip with cattle.

Tony Thompson
tony@...


Nelson Moyer
 

There was probably more manure on the watermelons than in the stock car, so maybe the stock car should have been disinfected after unloading the melons. Back in the 1940s, I watched my grandfather pull a manure spreader across one of his fields. The spreader was loaded with dried cow manure (cow pies), and the spreader had a rotating mechanism that pulled the load toward the end of the spreader where rotating blades chopped it up and distributed pieces on the ground, throwing a goodly part of the manure in the air in the process. Luckily, that was long before E. coli in cattle, so the human infection risk was minimal.

County fairs in the Midwest still have cow pie throwing contests.

Probably more than you wanted to know about cow manure.

Nelson Moyer

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tony Thompson
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2022 8:49 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

Bill Parks wrote:

I assume the stock cars got a good cleaning/disinfecting before loading the watermelons

Yep, after every trip with cattle.

Tony Thompson
tony@...


Doug Polinder
 

I am always open to more information about cow manure.  This type of spreader was still in common use into the 1960s in NW Washington, as my uncles used them on their dairy farms.  There was (and is) an intense concentration of dairy farms north of Seattle, and since cows defecate prodigiously you need to do something with it.  There is no grain crop in the area because land is limited so it had to be spread on pastures and the cattle rotated to other pastures until the manure worked into the ground.

To tie this BS topic to freight cars, some of those dairy cattle moved into (or out of) the area via the stock pen on the Great Northern in nearby Blaine WA, smack on the Canadian border.  The pen is pictured in Schafer's Classic American Railroads, vol. 1, in the GN chapter; the caption says the photo was taken in 1954.  I am told this pen was used until the mid 1960s.

Doug Polinder
native of Whatcom County WA
Seguin TX


David Wiggs
 

When I was a kid, many years ago, my uncle owned a Massey-Ferguson dealership.  Their motto was, "We'll stand behind all of our equipment except the manure spreader."

Davo in Orlando


Philip Dove
 

Was the type of disinfectant and disinfection process standardised?  were there disinfection depots or was itdone as soon as the cars were unloaded? Most importantly did the manure, cargo, or disinfection affect the appearance of the car and neighbouring track? 
As an example until the late 1920s British cars were disinfected with lime wash which could also used as, a, white paint disinfected cars could have the lower part of the car all white. 


Tim O'Connor
 


I think lye (caustic soda) was often used as a disinfectant to clean them which resulted in white stains
on the lower parts of some cars.

Tim O'Connor

On 5/25/2022 9:48 PM, Tony Thompson wrote:
Bill Parks wrote:

I assume the stock cars got a good cleaning/disinfecting before loading the watermelons

Yep, after every trip with cattle.

Tony Thompson

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Eric Hansmann
 

Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.

 

When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert G P
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2022 6:50 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

 

I know this was done as late as the 40s, any insight on how long it lasted and what other produce was shipped this way? Pumpkins I bet. 

 

-Bob G.P

 

 


Charlie Duckworth
 

I’ve got a series of photos in the M-I book of tomatoes being loaded in MP stock cars and one ART reefer in southern Illinois. What’s interesting is a portable scale being used to weigh the pickup trucks and wagons loaded and I assume weighed again light to get the net weight. 

On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 8:46 AM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:

Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.

 

When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert G P
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2022 6:50 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

 

I know this was done as late as the 40s, any insight on how long it lasted and what other produce was shipped this way? Pumpkins I bet. 

 

-Bob G.P

 

 


--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Tim O'Connor
 


Tomatoes were loaded seasonally into PRR stock cars for delivery to Campbell's soup factory in Camden NJ.
Not a long distance, but I'm sure the traffic was pretty substantial during the harvest season.


On 5/26/2022 9:57 AM, Charlie Duckworth wrote:
I’ve got a series of photos in the M-I book of tomatoes being loaded in MP stock cars and one ART reefer in southern Illinois. What’s interesting is a portable scale being used to weigh the pickup trucks and wagons loaded and I assume weighed again light to get the net weight. 

On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 8:46 AM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:

Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.

When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service.

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Steve SANDIFER
 

Watermelons, potatoes, tomatoes, oranges.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charlie Duckworth
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 8:57 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

 

I’ve got a series of photos in the M-I book of tomatoes being loaded in MP stock cars and one ART reefer in southern Illinois. What’s interesting is a portable scale being used to weigh the pickup trucks and wagons loaded and I assume weighed again light to get the net weight. 

 

On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 8:46 AM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:

Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.

 

When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert G P
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2022 6:50 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

 

I know this was done as late as the 40s, any insight on how long it lasted and what other produce was shipped this way? Pumpkins I bet. 

 

-Bob G.P

 

 


--
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne.


Bob Chaparro
 

Keep in mind during most of the period livestock were transported by rail the delivery points usually were grazing areas and auctions. Most of these facilities had no steam cleaning equipment.

To quote Steve Sandifer: 

“Every Santa Fe employee I interviewed in Texas, Kansas, and Oklahoma who personally handled livestock shipments said the cars were shoveled and swept and put back into service. None had ever heard of steam cleaning. I read documents and correspondence from San Angelo, Silsbee, Pawhuska, Chanute and Wellington that simply said shoveled and swept.  I’m not saying they were never steam cleaned, just that I cannot find anyone among the old heads who had ever heard of it. Never say never in the railroad business. I have viewed reports of clean out and bedding contractors in San Angelo, Lometa, Silsbee and Bellville – shovel and sweep.” 

The watermelons did not require a squeaky-clean car.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA 


Steve SANDIFER
 

I will add, that after the shipment of diseased animals there were specific instructions from the Bureau of Animal Industry concerning disinfecting the cars, pens, and anything they touched. However, that was an exception.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 12:22 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)

 

Keep in mind during most of the period livestock were transported by rail the delivery points such as grazing areas and auctions. Most of these facilities had no steam cleaning equipment.

To quote Steve Sandifer: 

“Every Santa Fe employee I interviewed in Texas, Kansas, and Oklahoma who personally handled livestock shipments said the cars were shoveled and swept and put back into service. None had ever heard of steam cleaning. I read documents and correspondence from San Angelo, Silsbee, Pawhuska, Chanute and Wellington that simply said shoveled and swept.  I’m not saying they were never steam cleaned, just that I cannot find anyone among the old heads who had ever heard of it. Never say never in the railroad business. I have viewed reports of clean out and bedding contractors in San Angelo, Lometa, Silsbee and Bellville – shovel and sweep.” 

The watermelons did not require a squeaky-clean car.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA 


Bill Keene
 

I have been told that the MKT also shipped cantaloupes north from Texas in stock cars. Unfortunately, I do not have any documentation on this. 

I believe that cantaloupes and watermelons were loaded on a bedding of straw. 

Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On May 26, 2022, at 8:20 AM, Steve SANDIFER <steve.sandifer@...> wrote:

Watermelons, potatoes, tomatoes, oranges.
 
 
J. Stephen Sandifer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charlie Duckworth
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 8:57 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)
 
I’ve got a series of photos in the M-I book of tomatoes being loaded in MP stock cars and one ART reefer in southern Illinois. What’s interesting is a portable scale being used to weigh the pickup trucks and wagons loaded and I assume weighed again light to get the net weight. 
 
On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 8:46 AM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:
Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.
 
When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service. 
 
 
Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN
 
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert G P
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2022 6:50 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)
 
I know this was done as late as the 40s, any insight on how long it lasted and what other produce was shipped this way? Pumpkins I bet. 
 
-Bob G.P
 
 

-- 
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne. 

<MKT 47240 stockcar watermelons.jpg><Kaw Valley potatoes, linwood, Leavenworth County KS, KSHS.jpg><PRR 134299 stockcar Tomato racks interior.jpg><1923 Virden California Citrus.jpg>


Robert G P
 

Yes, I shouldve mentioned, anytime produce was shipped in this fashion there was always a bed of straw. Possibly even straw in between layers as well. 

-Bob GP

On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 2:44 PM Bill Keene via groups.io <bill41=icloud.com@groups.io> wrote:
I have been told that the MKT also shipped cantaloupes north from Texas in stock cars. Unfortunately, I do not have any documentation on this. 

I believe that cantaloupes and watermelons were loaded on a bedding of straw. 

Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On May 26, 2022, at 8:20 AM, Steve SANDIFER <steve.sandifer@...> wrote:

Watermelons, potatoes, tomatoes, oranges.
 
 
J. Stephen Sandifer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charlie Duckworth
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 8:57 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)
 
I’ve got a series of photos in the M-I book of tomatoes being loaded in MP stock cars and one ART reefer in southern Illinois. What’s interesting is a portable scale being used to weigh the pickup trucks and wagons loaded and I assume weighed again light to get the net weight. 
 
On Thu, May 26, 2022 at 8:46 AM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:
Bushel baskets of peaches, apples, and tomatoes are probable candidates. These may have been stacked only two or three baskets high. It also depends upon the weather along the destination route.
 
When the harvest comes in and there’s a shortage of reefers or ventilated box cars, stock cars would be pressed into service. 
 
 
Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN
 
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Robert G P
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2022 6:50 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Watermelons In Livestock Car (Undated)
 
I know this was done as late as the 40s, any insight on how long it lasted and what other produce was shipped this way? Pumpkins I bet. 
 
-Bob G.P
 
 

-- 
Charlie Duckworth 
Omaha, Ne. 

<MKT 47240 stockcar watermelons.jpg><Kaw Valley potatoes, linwood, Leavenworth County KS, KSHS.jpg><PRR 134299 stockcar Tomato racks interior.jpg><1923 Virden California Citrus.jpg>