Topics

Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Bob Chaparro
 

I'm modeling several open car loads in HO scale.

The prototype examples I'm following show that wire is used above the load to tie the top of the stakes that secure the load from lateral movement.

Does anyone have a suggestion as to how to simulate the wires?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Allen Montgomery
 

I would use leftover thread from a Jaeger lumber load. Or you could use Pele's electrician tape idea. Never had luck with that myself.

Allen Montgomery



On Tuesday, October 15, 2019, 8:48:31 AM MST, Bob Chaparro via Groups.Io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:


I'm modeling several open car loads in HO scale.

The prototype examples I'm following show that wire is used above the load to tie the top of the stakes that secure the load from lateral movement.

Does anyone have a suggestion as to how to simulate the wires?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Bruce Smith
 

Bob,

Berkshire Junction EZ Line

Regards

Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."




On Oct 15, 2019, at 10:48 AM, Bob Chaparro via Groups.Io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:

I'm modeling several open car loads in HO scale.
The prototype examples I'm following show that wire is used above the load to tie the top of the stakes that secure the load from lateral movement.
Does anyone have a suggestion as to how to simulate the wires?
Thanks.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA
<Pipe_Load_Detail_Newberry_Library.jpg> <Pipe_Load_2__Pat_Huemmer.jpg><Pipe_Load_Cribbing_Library_of_Congress.jpg>

James Brewer
 

Bob,

I'd suggest EZ Line from Berkshire Junction...http://berkshirejunction.com/subdirectory/

Jim Brewer
Glenwood MD

On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 11:56 AM Allen Montgomery via Groups.Io <sandbear75=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I would use leftover thread from a Jaeger lumber load. Or you could use Pele's electrician tape idea. Never had luck with that myself.

Allen Montgomery



On Tuesday, October 15, 2019, 8:48:31 AM MST, Bob Chaparro via Groups.Io <chiefbobbb=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:


I'm modeling several open car loads in HO scale.

The prototype examples I'm following show that wire is used above the load to tie the top of the stakes that secure the load from lateral movement.

Does anyone have a suggestion as to how to simulate the wires?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Richard Townsend
 

I have used wire from the core of a damaged small electric motor. A bit tedious to unwind, but it is really fine. I also have used wire from a Taser (it helps to be friends with the police chief - they practice with their Tasers) but it is not as fine. In both cases the copper color might be objectionable.

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Chaparro via Groups.Io <chiefbobbb@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Tue, Oct 15, 2019 8:48 am
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

I'm modeling several open car loads in HO scale.
The prototype examples I'm following show that wire is used above the load to tie the top of the stakes that secure the load from lateral movement.
Does anyone have a suggestion as to how to simulate the wires?
Thanks.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA

Andy Carlson
 

Re-purposed armature wire from a broken model's electric motor. About as fine of wire you are going to easily find.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA





I'm modeling several open car loads in HO scale.

The prototype examples I'm following show that wire is used above the load to tie the top of the stakes that secure the load from lateral movement.

Does anyone have a suggestion as to how to simulate the wires?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

_._,_._,_


Patrick Wade
 

How about a single strand of lamp wire? I have used this for the harness and reins on an HO stagecoach.


On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 8:56 AM Allen Montgomery via Groups.Io <sandbear75=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I would use leftover thread from a Jaeger lumber load. Or you could use Pele's electrician tape idea. Never had luck with that myself.

Allen Montgomery



On Tuesday, October 15, 2019, 8:48:31 AM MST, Bob Chaparro via Groups.Io <chiefbobbb=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:


I'm modeling several open car loads in HO scale.

The prototype examples I'm following show that wire is used above the load to tie the top of the stakes that secure the load from lateral movement.

Does anyone have a suggestion as to how to simulate the wires?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Dave Parker
 

bob:

I think the answer depends on what diameter wire you are trying to simulate (presumably in HO scale?).

The EZ Line comes in 0.010" diameter, but that's 7/8" in HO.

Both fishing monofilament and braided beading line can be had as fine as 0.003".  

--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA

Nelson Moyer
 

I use black 1/64 in. chart tape for the steel straps. For wire, I use 32 AWG or 42 AWG magnet wire.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Allen Montgomery via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2019 10:56 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

I would use leftover thread from a Jaeger lumber load. Or you could use Pele's electrician tape idea. Never had luck with that myself.

 

Allen Montgomery

 

 

 

On Tuesday, October 15, 2019, 8:48:31 AM MST, Bob Chaparro via Groups.Io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:

 

 

I'm modeling several open car loads in HO scale.

The prototype examples I'm following show that wire is used above the load to tie the top of the stakes that secure the load from lateral movement.

Does anyone have a suggestion as to how to simulate the wires?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Jack Mullen
 

On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 09:28 AM, Dave Parker wrote:
I think the answer depends on what diameter wire you are trying to simulate (presumably in HO scale?).
Late steam era AAR loading requirements specify two strands of #7 wire, 3 strands of #8,  4 of #9, or 6 of #11, twisted taut. #7 ASW ga. is .177" dia, or .002" in HO.
40 AWG magnet wire, .0032" dia,  is the smallest I see in a quick search online. A 2 oz. spool for less than $10 plus shipping will give you over 4000', enough for everyone at the Chicago RPM to do a few cars. ;^)   As mentioned earlier, monofilament is available in similarly small diameters, but I don't see how you'd be able to twist the strands together. 
Jack Mullen

Nelson Moyer
 

Here’s a link for magnet wire in many gauges down to 44 AWG. Convert AWG to your scale inches and you can get close to prototype dimensions for whatever application you need.

 

https://www.remingtonindustries.com/magnet-wire/?sort=bestselling&page=1

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jack Mullen
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2019 2:42 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 09:28 AM, Dave Parker wrote:

I think the answer depends on what diameter wire you are trying to simulate (presumably in HO scale?).

Late steam era AAR loading requirements specify two strands of #7 wire, 3 strands of #8,  4 of #9, or 6 of #11, twisted taut. #7 ASW ga. is .177" dia, or .002" in HO.
40 AWG magnet wire, .0032" dia,  is the smallest I see in a quick search online. A 2 oz. spool for less than $10 plus shipping will give you over 4000', enough for everyone at the Chicago RPM to do a few cars. ;^)   As mentioned earlier, monofilament is available in similarly small diameters, but I don't see how you'd be able to twist the strands together. 
Jack Mullen

 


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Lester Breuer
 

Small piano or phosphor bronze wire as I used on this load is one way.
Lester Breuer

x702samc
 

 

 

An old modelers trick (I’m sure many of you must know) is to melt and stretch a “styrene” sprue.

 

Use a piece of sprue a couple of inches long or more, hold the center over an open flame until one end droops then pull both ends stretching the melted center. You can regulate the thickness of the strand buy how fast and far you pull the ends apart.

During the stretching you also can wrap it around a small bundle of pipe or logs or such. I wrap it around various sizes of tubes several times to represent coiled wire and if your careful wrap it slowly around a small tube to make coil springs.

Once you’ve tried and tested this you can make many different things.

 

 

 

 

 

Sam Clarke

R&D / Tech Advisor / Artist

Kadee Quality Products Co.

mail@...

541-826-3883

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

spsalso
 

E Z Line is flat, not round.  I measure it at .002" thick and .005" wide.  If it's twisted (and it's hard not to twist it), that shows.  It just might be a good thing for banding steel, though.  It's 3/8" wide, in HO.  Seems kinda narrow.

Also, the "rust" color fades to a clear green with a few hours of sunlight.  It seems to take permanent marker well, though, as a repair.

I am in the middle of using it to make a barbed wire fence about 5' long.  It's probably the only thing to use if you're trying to recreate a fence in good order, where the lines are still taut.  For my fence, I SUSPECT the twist in the E Z Line will not be noticeable unless you know to look.  I do, and I can see it.

Ed

Edward Sutorik

spsalso
 

Oh, yes.  The dimensions I gave were for the small stuff:  "Fine".  There's also a "Heavy".  May be thicker, certainly wider.--didn't get any.  THAT one might be better for banding.


Ed

Edward Sutorik

Jim Betz
 

Nelson/any one,

  The magnet wire certainly allows you to get scale size (close enough).

  Since it is not the correct color what methods have you used - successfully - to
change the color?  I'm thinking either an acrylic paint (wash?) or something
like Blacken-It.
  How did you twist it to get uniform twisting?  The tie downs were actually
different sizes of steel cable and that was produced in the factory.  I'm guessing
you can build a twisting jig that is similar to what they use at the factory to
produce evenly twisted cable ...

            https://atlantic-cable.com/Article/WireRope/nmachine.jpg

  What would you use to do the cable clamps of the style that can be seen here

           https://www.homedepot.com/p/Prime-Line-3-8-in-Galvanized-Cable-Clamp-2-Pack-GD-12253/205894139

I do not remember ever seeing parts like this in HO.

  One thing - I suspect that flat "cable" (banding) was not -commonly- used in the STMFC era.
I remember using steel banding to tie up pallets of cases of salmon in the early 60's but I
don't remember seeing anything other than cable for heavy loads.  Wrong about the dates?

                                                                                                         - Jim in Burlington 

  At least one option for clamps is to simply not try to do them ... ?

spsalso
 

I believe magnet wire always comes with insulation (otherwise it won't make a magnet).  If you use it, you'll be coloring the insulation.  Perhaps that same permanent marker I mentioned?  It comes in colors besides black.  I'm using dark umber.


Ed

Edward Sutorik

Nelson Moyer
 

I haven’t actually done wire tie-downs, just the 1/64 in. chart tape and chain on log loads. I’m getting four FM-11 flat cars from Jerry Hamsmith in Lisle, and I’ll need loads for them, so I’ll let you know how I did the wire after I do it. A jig sounds like it could work, just put two applicator sticks in a vise the same distance apart as opposite stake pockets, make a loop of wire and twist it by using a short piece of toothpick inserted at the center of the wire loop, which is basically what the prototype does. Magnet wire will hold its shape when twisted, so I would make the twisted loop a little shorter than the stake pocket space to be sure to have tension when installed.

 

I hadn’t thought about steel strap dates, but I assumed it was in use in the 1950s. Maybe I need to look at some photos taken in that decade. I probably won’t worry about clamps. I don’t build contest models any more.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jim Betz
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2019 6:04 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

Nelson/any one,

  The magnet wire certainly allows you to get scale size (close enough).

  Since it is not the correct color what methods have you used - successfully - to
change the color?  I'm thinking either an acrylic paint (wash?) or something
like Blacken-It.
  How did you twist it to get uniform twisting?  The tie downs were actually
different sizes of steel cable and that was produced in the factory.  I'm guessing
you can build a twisting jig that is similar to what they use at the factory to
produce evenly twisted cable ...

            https://atlantic-cable.com/Article/WireRope/nmachine.jpg

  What would you use to do the cable clamps of the style that can be seen here

           https://www.homedepot.com/p/Prime-Line-3-8-in-Galvanized-Cable-Clamp-2-Pack-GD-12253/205894139

I do not remember ever seeing parts like this in HO.

  One thing - I suspect that flat "cable" (banding) was not -commonly- used in the STMFC era.
I remember using steel banding to tie up pallets of cases of salmon in the early 60's but I
don't remember seeing anything other than cable for heavy loads.  Wrong about the dates?

                                                                                                         - Jim in Burlington 

  At least one option for clamps is to simply not try to do them ... ?

 


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Douglas Harding
 

According to https://patents.google.com/patent/US3421951

The first patent for steel strapping was applied for in 1966.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

Nelson Moyer
 

Oh well, just one more incongruence on my railroad.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Douglas Harding
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2019 9:53 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

According to https://patents.google.com/patent/US3421951

The first patent for steel strapping was applied for in 1966.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 


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