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Union Pacific Stock Car colors - FCR to Yellow?

Rob M.
 

I did a search but could find nothing conclusive - is there a specific time period or car series for the UP change from FCR to yellow for stock cars? 

I'm a right coaster but a fellow O scaler asked the question and could find no conclusive evidence so I bring it up to the experts here.

Rob Mondichak

Todd Sullivan
 

I don't know about a date, but in mid-summer 1959, I recall seeing strings of both red and yellow stock cars in sidings along the UP's Columbia Gorge main line.

Todd Sullivan.

Greg Martin
 

Rob,

If you review the Shake N Take project for the UP S 40-10 you'll find the answer including the first prototype car painted with black ends and roof and yellow nournal covers.

Greg Martin




On Wednesday, February 5, 2020 Rob M. via Groups.Io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> wrote:

I did a search but could find nothing conclusive - is there a specific time period or car series for the UP change from FCR to yellow for stock cars? 

I'm a right coaster but a fellow O scaler asked the question and could find no conclusive evidence so I bring it up to the experts here.

Rob Mondichak

--
Hey Boss,


Somehow I got deleted from this group in late May. I guess someone didn't like me. Jail is a lonely place.

Greg Martin 

Dick Harley
 


On the UP Freight Car Data portion of my SmugMug site is a gallery with a 3-page spreadsheet of UP Stock Car Data.
https://harley-trains.smugmug.com/UP-FRT-DATA

On the right side of the second page are three columns for Body Color - pre and post 1940.

It's been years since I built that spreadsheet, and I do not recall if I ever determined a pattern to the color choice, though there probably was one.
I guess determining that pattern is now "left as an exercise for the student."  May be solid versus roller bearing journals, but I've got too much other stuff to do.

Let us know if anyone figures out something.


Cheers,
Dick Harley
Laguna Beach,  CA

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford
 

Dick,

Good call on the journal boxes. On most roads yellow or silver usually indicated a car with roller bearings inside an older style journal box with a lid, often a conversion. I'm would be reasonably certain that was so of the UP cars, though documentation is always needed to be sure.

Yours Aye,

Garth Groff  🦆


On Thu, Feb 6, 2020 at 12:59 AM Dick Harley via Groups.Io <dick.harley4up=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:

On the UP Freight Car Data portion of my SmugMug site is a gallery with a 3-page spreadsheet of UP Stock Car Data.
https://harley-trains.smugmug.com/UP-FRT-DATA

On the right side of the second page are three columns for Body Color - pre and post 1940.

It's been years since I built that spreadsheet, and I do not recall if I ever determined a pattern to the color choice, though there probably was one.
I guess determining that pattern is now "left as an exercise for the student."  May be solid versus roller bearing journals, but I've got too much other stuff to do.

Let us know if anyone figures out something.


Cheers,
Dick Harley
Laguna Beach,  CA

Tim O'Connor
 

April 1947 according to Terry Metcalfe - and as Greg said, the S-40-10's were the first.

All of the S-40-12 cars were delivered in yellow. 300 had roller bearings and wore the
"livestock dispatch" lettering, and 200 had plain bearings and no such lettering.

In 1958, the decision was made to paint NON-roller bearing stock cars freight car red so
only "high speed" cars with roller bearings would be yellow.

Also according to Terry the Union Pacific's stock business rose after the war, unlike most
other railroads. High speed service to California evidently was the reason.

Tim O'

On 2/6/2020 12:58 AM, Dick Harley via Groups.Io wrote:

On the UP Freight Car Data portion of my SmugMug site is a gallery with a 3-page spreadsheet of UP Stock Car Data.
https://harley-trains.smugmug.com/UP-FRT-DATA

On the right side of the second page are three columns for Body Color - pre and post 1940.

It's been years since I built that spreadsheet, and I do not recall if I ever determined a pattern to the color choice, though there probably was one.
I guess determining that pattern is now "left as an exercise for the student."  May be solid versus roller bearing journals, but I've got too much other stuff to do.

Let us know if anyone figures out something.


Cheers,
Dick Harley
Laguna Beach,  CA
--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*

Dick Harley
 

Tim,

Where did you get the data about, "All of the S-40-12 cars were delivered in yellow." ?

Or, "In 1958, the decision was made to paint NON-roller bearing stock cars freight car red so
only 'high speed' cars with roller bearings would be yellow." ?

The non-roller bearing S-40-12s were UP #46800 - 46999.  Photos of that series are apparently scarce, but I have a photo of #46863D (Bob's Photo FUP20-A, San Diego, 4-'57) that is in FCR with a reweigh date of 10-55.
My spreadsheet also says those car sides were FCR, which agrees with UP drawing 303-C-10600, rev.A dated 6-12-50 (available at Colorado RR Museum).

The non-roller bearing S-40-13 class built in 1951-'52 also had FCR sides (Metcalfe book).

After a quick look, I can't find any NON-roller bearing UP stock cars painted with Armour Yellow sides.


Cheers,
Dick Harley
Laguna Beach,  CA


Tim O'Connor
 


Same source - Terry Metcalfe's UP freight cars book. 1st edition, published 1989.
The comments in the book seem anecdotal and not all classes are covered so I take
it with a grain of salt. I almost -always- try to find a photo before painting in
any case...



On 2/6/2020 1:54 PM, Dick Harley via Groups.Io wrote:
Tim,

Where did you get the data about, "All of the S-40-12 cars were delivered in yellow." ?

Or, "In 1958, the decision was made to paint NON-roller bearing stock cars freight car red so
only 'high speed' cars with roller bearings would be yellow." ?

The non-roller bearing S-40-12s were UP #46800 - 46999.  Photos of that series are apparently scarce, but I have a photo of #46863D (Bob's Photo FUP20-A, San Diego, 4-'57) that is in FCR with a reweigh date of 10-55.
My spreadsheet also says those car sides were FCR, which agrees with UP drawing 303-C-10600, rev.A dated 6-12-50 (available at Colorado RR Museum).

The non-roller bearing S-40-13 class built in 1951-'52 also had FCR sides (Metcalfe book).

After a quick look, I can't find any NON-roller bearing UP stock cars painted with Armour Yellow sides.


Cheers,
Dick Harley
Laguna Beach,  CA

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Rob M.
 

Thank you gents.   We're O scalers so some of us don't get out as much as we should. 

I'll mention this all to the gentleman who asked the original question and he will most likely have to apply the findings to the available O scale models.  Right off the top we do have Yoder S-40-6 which is nicely done in FCR.

He indicated he had joined this group but was waiting approval. I told him to make sure he got he right STMFC. 

Rob Mondichak

Dick Harley
 

Tim,

Care to give me a page number in Terry's book?  I can't find your data in it.

I did notice that even the diagram in Terry's book (p. 145) for the S-40-12 class lists both AY and FCR side Color Schemes for the different series.

I'm beginning to think this is another trick by Tim to get Dick to do the research.  :-)
Just put out some bogus facts about UP or PFE, and Dick will jump in to correct it, since he hates bogus facts (from any source).


Cheers,
Dick Harley
Laguna Beach,  CA

Tony Thompson
 

Rob Mondichak wrote:

I did a search but could find nothing conclusive - is there a specific time period or car series for the UP change from FCR to yellow for stock cars? 

     The UP first painted stock cars yellow (with aluminum roof and ends) in early 1947, when they inaugurated a fast livestock service between Salt Lake and Los Angeles. The paint scheme was ONLY for the cars in that service,which had been equipped with roller-bearing trucks. All other stock car remained BCR. Gradually more and more of the BCR cars received aluminum roofs. 
       AFAIK this pattern of paint assignment remained through the 1950s. Others on this list can doubtless stay more.

Tony Thompson



Tim O'Connor
 

Dick

Darn it, you finally figured it out! I've been doing it for years. You'd be
amazed what I've been able to squeeze out of the "fact hoarders". ;-)

On 2/6/2020 4:16 PM, Dick Harley via Groups.Io wrote:
Tim,

Care to give me a page number in Terry's book?  I can't find your data in it.

I did notice that even the diagram in Terry's book (p. 145) for the S-40-12 class lists both AY and FCR side Color Schemes for the different series.

I'm beginning to think this is another trick by Tim to get Dick to do the research.  :-)
Just put out some bogus facts about UP or PFE, and Dick will jump in to correct it, since he hates bogus facts (from any source).


Cheers,
Dick Harley
--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*